I'd just like to give you my opinion, earth empires seems to favour the top players as they just easily bottom feed the lower players as they see them as easy pickings, I've been attacked off just about every top 10 player on primary and it's impossible to attack them back due to their size! I tried to send a missile back but noooo he's protected by the GDI, I tried to do a guerrilla strike but once again it was blocked by the GDI because he's protected! I mean he's 10 million in net worth and I'm 2.3million, should something not be done to stop this kind of thing and make it fair for all and not all one sided.

No wonder there is only 500 or so people play the game, it has great potential to grow but I think it's this that puts many people off from coming back in the next set to play another round, I'm still debating whether to carry on playing or not if it keeps happening which I'm guessing it will.

you can do harmful spyops.

Like someone who is bombing my banks :(

From my experience, sending a missile or GS or whatever against a player that far ahead will cause them to think one of three things:

1) "Let's not do that again. I'm here to peacefully net, so I'll just move along to other targets of opportunity."
2) "I'm here to net, and luckily, someone has given me a reason to take even more of their land."
3) "Oh, you want to dance? Let's dance! I wasn't wearing my dancing shoes, but my country is strong enough (as evidenced by my NW) that I can still boogie down with the best of them."


In other words, there is a decent chance the pain would not end just because you sent retaliatory strikes. This situation with GDI blocking you from doing what you want may be a case of "Careful What You Wish For" - Sometimes the most productive course of action is to regroup, recoup your losses, and try to become a less attractive target. You can't excel without land, but land you can't hold does you know good. Sometimes you have to shrink to grow.


This has been a far more difficult reset than the last for me personally. I have had to do just this - stunt my growth myself in order to minimize others stunting it for me. I have had to become a less attractive country in order to become a better country.

I feel your pain, Kingshaun2k, and I hope you can overcome early troubles to have a rewarding reset. That has been my goal as well.

And as an aside... Although I still don't fully comprehend the new DR rules (I never claimed to be smart or to be good at this game or whatever), I did enter this reset expecting it to be much more difficult to be sufficiently unattractive to avoid hits.

That's the problem I'm struggling to grow because everyday I've logged in I've been hit multiple times losing quite a bit of land and losing lots of units!

You have to plan how not to be a target from the start. If you think you can hang low and start off with low military, you're wrong. If you think you can hang low and stockpile in decent land, you're wrong. In primary you have to get ahead and stay ahead.

If you want tag protection to peacefully all explore and do your thing, alliance server would be best for your playing style. If you want an everything goes, every man for himself competition.... This is where its at. Just do some calculations, ask for advise from top players, and get planning for your next round so you can be ready to compete.

I have 7k acres and 2.6million turrets. The guy who is number one in the primary server has less turrets than me, why don't people in the top 10 attack him for larger grabs instead of feeding off the poor.

its been a hard set for me as well been attacked more times this set then any other set. It happens i fell back behind the herd and now paying the price :-\
Dont give up just rethink your strategy and try again

And because people like playing it safe there affraid that the bigger ones will retal.

I last played this game about 10 year ago when it was called Earth 2025 so I have a basic understanding of how to play. I attack most days and gain some acres, log off and come bak on the next day and I've lost them all again so it's pretty much impossible for me to grow, I'm having to sell as many jets on the market as I can to gain money to build those acres up that I captured just to lose then again withing 24 hours. I've barely got any jets left now

My recommendation is to play Alliance with a good alliance(see: http://www.lafamiglia.org)

learn some good strategies, get some advice from people who have played in primary before, and come back next set and grind some other people's gears.

Yeah Kingshaun2k, once you fall behind, it is very difficult to climb back up, that is the nature of solo servers, survival of the fittest.

Ya i know what you.mean just remember to get some tanks and troops, i like tanks but they will help beef up you defense at the same time they pose a threat to any one hitting you. Before you log out try buying turrets to make your jets and turrets equal. Then from there just pray lol if you need me to explain it better pm me and ill see what i can do. But like i said it will take some hard work to get back on track.

The reason they hit you and not the guy in top place is because that top guy can A. retal and B. Bring it if needed after said retal.

yep and will most likely get more land back when retalling than lost in orig. attack.

Any game 'favors the top players'.. but it's actually that the top players of any game understand the rules/mechanics and know how to use it to maximize their performance. Some of the ppl in this thread have offered some good advice. Figure out the strat you want to run (you'll want to specialize in something) and then figure out what makes that strat strong and how to be better than other players at it.

Just lost another 500 acres off a lot higher players, think I'm about to quit. It's a bit pathetic now if you ask me....

Your forces will not spy on such a large opponent!

Can't even retal them with spy ops but they can easily attack me. Hmmmm

They grew after the attack and probably considered this before attacking you. Why quit? Join one of the clans in alliance there is lots of good players that can give you a base to work with and come back next set and do a bit better in primary surely :)

If I can offer some advice, take the hits until you figure the game out for yourself. Don't worry about retals. Realize it will take more than one reset to figure out the game mechanics.

I like using the Express server to learn strategies. I started by experimenting with different strategies and netting before I started learning the art of warfare. I'm still learning both, but getting better all the time. I probably won't break the top 100 on the Primary this time, but I've learned a lot that I want to do for the next reset.

In the mean time, beef up defense and focus on netting with your strategy.

Maybe stop getting land for a few days and beef up your tech levels? You can have the same level of production having high techs and lower land. Try something different to break the cycle instead of doing the same wrong tactic over and over and then complaining about it.

Everyone starts off on the same footing every 2 months, there's a reason why the top players always finish on top, it's because they've figured out how to get there instead of complaining and just quitting. You can blame the game rules all you want for your mistakes, but that won't change anything. Instead figure out how the top players got there, we're all giving you hints in this thread and you're just choosing to ignore them because blaming the game is easier than trying to change.

If you want, pm me. I can help you for your next set. I probably am one of the guys that grabbed you though, hope that's not a problem. ;-).

Xinhuan offers lots of advise too, and I'm offering his service to you too. :-P

Play CI. Make jets and smash them into people.

Cheesiest strat ever for solo servers.

Dont quit or get discouraged, rather ask players for advice, join 1A as its starting up again soon and play turns every 48 hours. The top players will out grow you, then you can run turns and bounce back into a rythem.

It might be cheesiest, but only 1 CI has won Primary in the last 2 years (12 resets). So no, not really cheesy at all.

What I'm trying to say is they can grab me but I can't hit them back because 99% of them have GDI because it's free! I can't really do anything I'm just stuck at around 2mil net worth , beefing up tech won't exactly stop them from hitting me, lost over 2k acres and 1 million turrets in 24hours. What exactly can i do??

LATC'S ADVICE TO YOU WAS QUITE GOOD.

IF YOU ARE GETTING HIT THAT FREQUENTLY AND DO NOT HAVE THE TECH CATEGORIES MAXED WHICH ARE RELEVANT TO YOUR CHOSEN STRATEGY, THEN YOU SHOULD FORGET ABOUT GAINING LAND FOR A FEW DAYS. MAX OUT THOSE TECH CATEGORIES (OR GET THEM CLOSE). YOU'LL PRODUCE MORE, AND YOU'LL BE A LESS DESIREABLE TARGET.

YOU WILL STILL PROBABLY BE HIT, BECAUSE AT THIS POINT IN THE RESET, THE TOP PLAYERS HAVE A VERY LIMITED NUMBER OF TARGETS TO CHOOSE FROM (ONE OF THE DOWN SIDES OF THE 4X HUMANITARIANS). HOWEVER, YOU MAY GO FROM BEING HIT 3-5 TIMES PER DAY TO BEING HIT 1-2 TIMES PER DAY, AS OTHERS AROUND YOU IN THE SCORES LIST BEGIN TO LOOK MORE DESIREABLE (LANDFAT) THAN YOU.

Right, so basically the point of maxing tech is to have the same production level at lower land. As a top 20 player, I'll tell you, the way I pick targets is, find countries around 1/4 my NW and then start spying on the guys with the highest land. If there is no threat of retaliation by missile, AB, or spies I'll go ahead and hit the target multiple times.

So the trick is to blend in with those around you in NW. And once your tech levels are good and you've amassed some cash.. then you get more land and consequently more NW right after so you once again blend in w/ those around you. Although the best alternative is to get out in front and stay in front since top players don't hit top players because of the eventual retal that would happen.

I'll buy some tech then, should I max them all?

So what's the best way to use turns as an communism / industrialist?? Should i just produce one thing and sell as many as i can?

99% of your land should be built as indies. The other 1% should be construction sites. 60-80 BPT should be enough for you, though a top player aiming for about 50k-60k land goes for about 90-100 BPT.

Produce mainly jets and turrets for selling, you get more $$ per indy's worth of production out of those 2 units than troops or tanks. Plus because of GDI, there is very little demand for troops and tanks, since people that don't double tap are immune to those ABs and GSes.

Yup, rebuild all buildings to indies, then get your Indy tech up to at least 150%. Try to get your weapons tech up too. 130%-140% would be great. By that time you'll be small in land compared to others your size, and can start growing again. You'll have enough production to fund your building, and boosting tech.

Once your tech is in the 150-155 % range, start boosting your business and residential techs too. You'll be surprised at how big a difference having those two techs make to your cash flow per turn. You may even get in the positive for a while.

If you find you don't have enough cash to fund tech after building what you grab, just sell maximum jets/turrets and log in twice per day instead of once. Double selling is great for boosting tech quickly.

And just a side note that may be obvious, as a commie industrialist you'll be running turns with negative cash flow and food most of the set. ALL your funding comes from selling crap you produce.

When I first started playing, and I think a lot of new players in general, I was afraid to run w/ negative cash and food hence why most beginners do a rainbow strat.. that's also probably why I've played casher for the majority of a decade haha.

I love you LATC!!, superb salesman ;-)


All of you go buy my tech :p

you're not afraid of seeing negative bushels?

Haha...

Not anymore, money can't buy happiness but it sure can buy a LOT of bushels.

Actually humanitarians is there for that. GDI actually does protect little guys form being farmed. Without GDI I, along with many top players, would farm guys to oblivion to make sure they couldn't retal. With GDI the way it is now though, I'll generally only hit a guy (who looks like he could retal me with anything) once and move on.

It's not malicious intent, grabbing is part of the game and is inevitable, so with or without GDI it's about minimizing the threat of retaliation. GDI limits that threat without me needing to cripple a country completely before moving on.

Dude, this is exactly the thing that I have the biggest issue with, although if you are unable to retaliate using any means that works, it's unfortunate. The problem I run into is the idiot's gang of buddies that resent the idea that their friend can be hurt by a smaller country. The reason they attack little countries is they are fundamentally cowards with no sack to speak of, that are absolutely terrified of being retaliated upon successfully. The GDI thingy is annoying as hell though, I must admit, when they can hide behind that on whatever side, just pisses me off to no end, but there are rules that work it that way, if he hits you multiple times, GDI will not protect him. If he just hits you once and jumps out of the GDI range, there isn't much you can do about except try to get back into range where you can strike at him. Look at that as your games work. Get big enough to damage the guys that have hit you. Simple really.

I'm boosting tech now, what's the best way to use my turns as a communist/Indy to produce units to sell on the market?

Thanks for all the help so far.

This is a very interesting quote, seems to go against the tide of those who would claim "topfeeding" OMG, he top fed me even though his net was more, his land was less, that makes it a topfeed.

Thank You for posting this in such a way. :)

Now, all you topfeeding whiners can just go and pound sand.

Why pay for something you can get free right? If two guys offered you identical pizza, one for free the other said you MIGHT have to pay me tomorrow depending on my mood, which one do you take?

Or thought of another way, why take something you need from someone that can punish you when you can take it from someone who most likely can't hurt you? Let me tell you the parable of two dudes.

Two dudes move next door to each other in a high crime area at the same time and both start with $50k. Dude one buys a scooter, some shiny lights, racing stripes, and a water gun. Dude two buys a Humvee, some gas, and .50 caliber to mount on his Humvee. One day both dudes leave food out in their yard.

LATC comes by and he's starving, absolutely famished. Looks at the two dudes driveways and takes the food from the scooter dude and drives away in his lambo. Scooter dude's like, dude wtf, why'd you take my food? I can't even chase you down and my water gun won't reach or hurt you! It's not fair!

Meanwhile KoHeartsGPA is like, tehehehehe watch me be sneaky and steal from dude two and drive off in my corvette. Dude two's all like, oh hell no! Chases him down and shoots out his tires w/ his .50 cal. Dude two takes his food back along with KoH's wallet and some tech points that were sitting in his front seat and then kicks KoH in the crotch for good measure. Ouch.

True story.

What can we learn from the parable of two dudes? Each reset every player starts with the same amount. Some players use their turns wisely/efficiently to get out in front and protect themselves, some use their turns poorly/inefficiently and make themselves vulnerable to be picked on. IT IS NOT THE STRONG PLAYERS FAULT THAT THE WEAK PLAYERS MADE POOR CHOICES TO PUT THEMSELVES IN A VULNERABLE POSITION. Learn from the mistakes of your previous reset and make better choices next reset. If you don't know how, ask. There are plenty of top players who are willing to teach.

Also we learned that KoH stopped being a pirate and is now awesome =P <3

Wait... More NW than target + less land than target = Topfeeder?

Am I misunderstanding the premise and the set up? Is this really a thing?

I usually just build CS until my BPT goal. Once BPT goal is reached, excess turns go into exploring. Once that is no longer profitable (near end of reset), they go into cashing turns.

I classify the attack by intent.

If an attack is made and the target cannot possibly retal, then it is bottomfeeding.

If an attack is made and the target can retal, so you make a valiant effort to jump out of range or possibility of retalling (called outrunning the retal), it is midfeeding.

If an attack is made with the intention of profiting off the retal (because the retal will take less land than you gained), then it is topfeeding. This is by far the most inefficient way of gaining land because you are wasting resources to get something to lose part of it. Collaborative topfeeding is called "landtrading", and works on non-solo servers due to generation of ghost acres, but is banned on solo servers (deletable offense) as that is considered cooperation.

as a CI, you want your Industrial tech maxed. Follow that with Military, Business, and Residential - in that order. There are two ways I see continuing to produce. I tend to lean towards the all explore, which is just using turns to explore. You gotta make sure you keep an eye on your food levels and cash levels when you do a batch explore (exploring a lot at once is better than just one turn at a time. trust me or read the wiki). The other option I try to avoid is cashing turns. You produce just as normal, but you lose less money cashing turns. You don't actually gain anything out of it, though - that's why I'd recommend exploring.

There's a third option - warring - which I'll recommend avoiding until next set. Essentially you spy on other countries to see what their armies are like, then do a Standard or Planned Strike against them. It's essentially power vs power. Troops=1 Jets/Turrets(Attack/Defense)=2, Tanks=4. Standard is 1:1 Planned gives you a 50% power bonus and also puts your attacking brigade out of commission for 20 RW hours. Your opponent's government bonus + weapons tech also play a direct effect on their army's power as does your tech. You'll also end up spending 1 barrel of oil for every 25 units sent into combat.

Don't neglect defensive alliances can provide your opponent with up to twice the spied defense power and to account for 10% of random chance thrown in there for good luck.

For starters, there is no functional difference in your definition of bottomfeeding and midfeeding. In both cases the attempt to outrun the retal is present. The only distinction you make is whether or not that attempt is guaranteed to succeed.

Also, it baffles my mind how someone with significantly more NW than any one of their targets could ever be considered a topfeeder. What happened to people just being fat?

@Viceroy That's because midfeeding doesn't really exist on Primary in the sense because retal windows are the entire reset, but it does exist on clan servers. What happens is that you know that your clan has a 48 hour retal policy, and you farm some weaker clan, and jump massively in turrets for the next 48 hours to avoid the retals, after which you can sell off the turrets. A "retal" after that day would be a new attack and can be retalled by L:L.

For example, if the top country in that clan has 2m jets and can produce 1m jets per day, so the maximum jets he can have is 4m jets. Coupled with Offensive alliances, I have to defend against a potential ~6m jets PS (assuming his O allies are smaller in jets than him since you always defend against the top retaller), so you jump to 7m turrets the first day, 8-9m the next day, and 10m turrets the final day.

An alternate meaning of midfeeding is simply grabbing people that are 1/3-1/2 your size, while bottomfeeding is more 1/4-1/3 your size, but this is NW based and obviously the larger your target, the higher chances it can retal you later.


Like I said, I define topfeeding based on intent to gain a land profit after the retal. Generally it is accepted that this is the least effective way to gain land by attacking (the only less efficient way is to explore). Landtrading only works if both countries hold next to no defense to avoid incurring
upkeep, and attacking losses, and are built a very specific way (high strat tech, no weapons) and nearly 1.5x-2x the usual amount of CSes.

Xinhuan's advice is sound. Spend a few days just exploring with your turns. Only produce jets/turrets and Sell maximum amount daily. Keep buying up your Indy/bus/res/weapons techs. Once your Indy tech is over 150%, start grabbing, building indies, & buying more of those techs daily. That's it man.