Let me further explain this to you. ESD was created so that any player that joined could play as he or she wanted to so long as they did not violate clan rules or fluff over any non-clan player.

ESD has never been, is not now, nor ever will be what most of you see as an FFA Clan. That ain't the way ESD works. A couple of our guys decided to adjust how THEY wanted to play after that. And that's cool. But nobody dictates how an ESD member plays the game.

Each member does or does not do what they want or do not want to do based on the immediate situation. It shouldn't be really hard to understand. ESD has always been, is now, and always will be simply a co-operative of players who individually choose to play how they they wish so long as they follow some simple rules and don't fluff up the game play of non-clan players.

There is no "leader" in ESD. We are ALL leaders and NONE of us are leaders. We are a collective. I just happen to be the guy who handles issues when someone needs a contact.

Which is pretty funny considering that ESD goes out of its way to AVOID issues by not permitting grabs on players outside the tag.

When NBK FS'd ESD, they were basically telling each and every one of us that we would NOT play like we wanted but rather how THEY wanted us to play.

Most of us decided that was an unacceptable attitude. But in the spirit of the philosophy of ESD, a couple players decided to change their path and found some fun in pursuing continued play.

I'm extremely PROUD of that. Jade Penn and Swedish Viper are exercising the very guarantee that ESD provided them from the moment they tagged up to begin with. THEY "get it". It is totally up to THEM whether they fight back and NOT up to NBK.

My work is done here. :)

you could of helped PAN win, gained NBK's respect, and it would of taken a few weeks.

instead you told the entire server you will not fight.

it is that simple. you can not run your mouth like you always do, and not expect to have to back it up every few sets.

And there explains the entire penury of your argument better than I could ever do so. You make ESD's case better than ay of its members eve could, you fool.

ESD does not exist to "gain" the respect of you, NBK, or any other player or clan on the FFA sever, you fluffing idiot.

What - I - say or do as a single member of an independent collective can or can not be taken any way the community decides.

The funny part is that you are SO fixated on me. It's almost creepy. But kinda sexy cause I have a stalker. I'm guessing you'd like to taste me. May I send you a sperm sample? PM me your address. We can Skype the actual event. That would be hot.

Bottom line, asshole. We do not have to explain to you how we do or do not play this game. We do not have to explain to you how we do or do not respond to any action taken against the tag, and that response MAY WELL include some, none, or all members fighting back, vacationing, or deleting countries.

I don't suppose you've noticed that 90% of the "Anti-Dragon Rhetoric" is posted by you and you alone. So you're either a Hero Of The Silent or just a fluffing moron.

And we both know which you are.

now you are just quoting yourself and calling me names.

Well if I don't call you names, there's not much else I can say to you. It's not like you're tremendously respected on the server.

MY suggestion would be to crawl back under your bridge and review the notes on both African and European Swallows so that you have a definitive answer when asked.

dont think of yourself so highly. i troll everyone i think does tarded fluff. ask IMP or rockman, or NBK back in the day. you arnt that important to me, just something to do while i watch my kids and do some work.

and as for me being respected. those i fight alongside respect me, and that is all the respect i desire. the respect of someone who fluffed constantly and doesnt fight beck when given the opportunity, the respect of them is not something i desire.

i eagerly await next set to see what you have to fluff about then.

I know. But it's fun fighting with you.

you dont fight, you just call me names. it is disappointing.

Tell you what. When you stop reverting to rhetoric and the same old fluff every other post in terms of me, I'll stop calling you names.

Even if those names apply.

it is hard to stop saying the same things about you, when you keep doing the same things. i.e. talking a big talk, but walking away when given the opportunity.

i seem to remember you detagging and telling NBK to come at you bro last set.


do you see how i got through that point without calling you a name?

Some people have no interest in warring. Some people just don't have the time to sit around next to a computer so that they can stonewall.

FSing an alliance that is netting means that many of the countries you hit are from people who have no desire or will to war. If those people don't choose to fight, that's just as if you recruit people to a war alliance, and promise them a war, and then criticize them for not putting up 200m+ anw because you ended up not warring. Those warmongers wouldn't have the interest to play a full netting set. If they created their countries expected a war, and then got blind sided by a netting set, they'd either do a horrible job netting, or they'd go inactive. How can people not see the similarity between forcing netters to war unexpected, and forcing warmongers to netgain unexpectedly?

As much as Dragon and I don't get along, ESD does follow the most important rule to me in EE - they play with honor. I wish more people would respect that.

pact better, if you cant get a pact from a war clan, you cant call it a blindside.

For a long time, ESD had a FDP with NBK, fordy. One set, I tried to uphold it by myself because I agreed to it without discussing it with the other members of ESD.

THEY had no interest in such pacts and that was cool. Ask QM. He'll verify this. That was MY bad but I did my best (which was not good enough) to uphold the pact.

I even APOLOGIZED to NBK publicly for my personal inability to not be able to fully provide the "protection" an FDP demands.

SO let's not talk about "pacting better", eh? Let's talk about assholes who just won't let people play on the server in a way they disagree with. Let's just be honest. Ooh Ooh. NBK's Big fluff in my ass feels especially good without lube.

SO they've shown that unless everyone plays THEIR way, they will not play. This is in direct conflict with ESD's philosophy of every player playing how THEY want to play as opposed to how OTHERS force them to play.

This really isn't terribly difficult to grasp, fordy. You just have a vested interest in keeping fluff stirred because that's what YOU get out of the game.

Rockman: K4F and I had this exact argument on a thread about 2 years ago when NBK came after PAN and FoCuS (which was the 2nd time in 3 resets NBK came after us).

At the same time, when it happens as infrequently as it has recently, I don't feel it's quite as fair to criticize NBK. Because of lack of options, sometimes war clans have to go without war. This set, we as netgaining clans have to go without netgaining.

If NBK goes after PAN and ESD next set, then they're being assholes. So note to NBK: Don't FS us next set unless you want to be assholes.

Logic on the internet? I didn't know that was allowed???

and if you can not come up with a answer to a good argument, then just mention "pact better".

Call me old fashion, but can recall a time when a legit reason was the cause of a war and not just because the members of one clan got bored. If the argument of "pact better" is the only way not to be attacked again next set and coming sets, then for a netter it is actually pointless to keep on playing the game.

And if that argument of "pact better" is true for the FFA of today, then a simple ... bye bye will suffice.

Wow. I just typed up a huge reply to fordy, hit a key I apparently shouldn't have and it's all gone.

fluff it.

umm we had a pact until YOU went apenuts and dropped it publically on FFAT because of something papasmurf said about another server.

Also, just cause we warred you one set doesn't mean we are forcing you to play our way. Do you hear us complaining cause you net and are forcing us to play your way when you don't war?

synoder: I'm generally not arguing against you, but PAN or ESD deciding to netgain doesn't force you to netgain. You declaring war on us does force us to war (or at least not to netgain--as most of ESD showed, it doesn't force you to actually war).

So your logic there is a bit faulty. War clans inherently have more power on the server because everyone respects the idea of someone legitimately declaring war on someone else, but no one would respect if PAN made a declaration of a netgaining competition on NBK or CC.

Dude, your fluff is weak. No matter what - I - said, YOU decided to hit a netting tag that doesn't even grab outside its clan. This was maybe the biggest fluff move in FFA history. Awesome job!

fluffing heroes, you are.

he doesnt seem to think that his tardedness effects him and his clan. let him be.

fair enough twain, but if we dont have anyone to war we are forced to either netgain or hit a netting tag. But yeah, you can't actually make us netgain.

Dragon, I was responding to what you said about why we dont have a pact. stay on topic ;) And that is by far not worst move in ffa history. lol

Dude.. There's nothing you can say. If NBK had a problem with ME, NBK could have just taken MY countries out.

The FUNNY part is that your FS didn't even touch me. It took out a ton of countries belonging to a veteran player who had JUST come back from years out of the game. And he won't be back, by the way. Due to YOUR actions.

You guys are fluffing geniuses!

And no, fordy.. That's not on me. No matter what your delusional brain thinks.

again, i dont feel sorry for people who quit the game because they got warred one set. He would have been hit by a suicider sooner or later and would have quit anyways.

OmG, people rage quitting?! Like this is new.

Dont come play a war game and expect everything to be rainbows and roses...its silly man. One set, it ne different it was everyset or every other...but cmon how long has it been?

Try and rationalize it any way you want. The truth remains that is was a fluff POS move. You'll never escape that.

Mighty NBK fluffed a weaksauce opponent in their ass. AWESOME! You guys will be fluffing legends!

Llaar, fordy, and zip killed an almost innactive XI last set..we had our two minute WTF face on...then we was like meh, fluff happens...

it is on you. you raged at NBK over another member. you dropped the pact publicly on FFAT you burned a bridge with NBK

on what planet is that NOT on you?

http://img853.imageshack.us/...806/everydayimrustlin.gif

None of that warrants a war dec, or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe just speaking one's opinions or standing up for one's convictions is subject to review and punishment.

The funny part is that it is always and only YOU that continues to initiate this dialogue against me. At first, it made me angry. Then it made me laugh. Now, as much as I hate to admit it, it makes me horny, you sexy man.

Want some?

no, i dont go for chubby ragers.

I think you do. Although I also think you like to hog tie Man Ass and get some from behind. You make me hot just thinking about it.

i prefer to fluff weaklings. that way they dont scream too loud when i go in dry

You know, we're pretty much done without fresh material.

if you went camping with a few friends, and woke up one morning in your tent with a condom sticking out of your ass, would you tell anyone?

That's one of my favorite jokes. It's amazing how many people fall for it.

Look at you guys. If you go down this path, you might actually become friends.

fluff that fluff fluff

u people type too much. i read the first post but damm im all set!

Yeah reading none of this....

All I wanted to say is that the air is still not clean, you suck Dragon.

maybe if i get bored tom i will :D

SSDD

Dragon you are missing the whole point of being in a clan. That 'be free' approach does not work. A clan is supposed to a group of people banded together for mutual defense (for netting clans).

Now this will not stop a strong clan like NBK from attacking but it will stop a smaller clan. With your approach you will always be pushed around by some itty-bitty wanna-be clan because you have no deterent.

Why bother having a clan at all?

Every clan needs a killer. or two. or even better, everyone.

Joeskin, we're missin ya!

No dude, YOU are missing what ESD has always bee about. I don't kow how may times I have to say it. Or how to counterract the repeated assaults on you by the Stupid Stick.

ESD never was, is not now or never WILL be the model of what you or anyone ELSE thinks a "clan" is.

And since 2001, I have repeatedly advertized that fact early and often.

If idiot moron fluffs like fordy (and apparently you) want to continue to troll and spout off to any idiot who wants to hear, that's cool.

But let me tell you something. People like you and fordy simply and greedily eat the fluff that outfits like NBK give you while they eat.

That's cool. If you guys are sucking fluff out of rectums, that's cool. Everyone has to make a living. You don't like me. That's fine. The big difference between me and you is that I don't lack the balls to call a spade a spade and that I am unwilling to keep my mouth shut and hide in the shadows like you POS coward trolls do.

But feel empowered Big Man. And go fluff yourself.

Some people have no interest in warring.

Then they might not want to play a war game...



not permitting grabs on players outside the tag.

Ahhh, yes, back to the fundamentals. This is like the person that cuts themselves.. Your own countries hit themselves, which takes readiness.. It's a bad thing they did, when they encouraged self farming, in my opinion..

The game's dying! Again.. :O(

It's not NBK killing it!

In fact, you think we don't lose players, because there's no one to war? WRONG..

We can't get all butt hurt and blame tree hungers for causing us to lose players.

So, it's not NBK that caused an ESD member to beat feet..


btw, if we feed anyone fluff.... It'll be of fine quality!




THEY "get it". It is totally up to THEM whether they fight back and NOT up to NBK.

Had we commanded you, to defend your countries, or tell you MUST counter... at any point?


Anyone that doesn't protect their countries will end up being someones fluff..


That's it!!

Some people have no interest in warring.

Then they might not want to play a war game...



not permitting grabs on players outside the tag.

Ahhh, yes, back to the fundamentals. This is like the person that cuts themselves.. Your own countries hit themselves, which takes readiness.. It's a bad thing they did, when they encouraged self farming, in my opinion..

The game's dying! Again.. :O(

It's not NBK killing it!

In fact, you think we don't lose players, because there's no one to war? WRONG..

We can't get all butt hurt and blame tree hungers for causing us to lose players.

So, it's not NBK that caused an ESD member to beat feet..


btw, if we feed anyone fluff.... It'll be of fine quality!




THEY "get it". It is totally up to THEM whether they fight back and NOT up to NBK.

Had we commanded you, to defend your countries, or tell you MUST counter... at any point?


Anyone that doesn't protect their countries will end up being someones fluff..


That's it!!