in that stupid ass youtube experiment you are assuming laboratory like conditions, and balls that just sat there instead of getting used. this is why an experiment without a control is stupid. in addition, the balls were measured INDOORS at the same 75 degree temp you are claiming. more than likely the balls had started equalizing once again. not in the 45 degree outside temperature that your precious experiment is assuming. the colts balls probably were sub 12.5 PSI on the field, the fact that the patriots were even lower is the problem. that experiment is worthless. it is biased. it isnt real science. you keep ignoring variables because they are inconvenient for you.

i can tell you dont science much, so there isnt much point in debating this with you.

if you want a real experiment you need to drop the temp of the balls, then raise it back up, and see how much air was lost. im guessing a lot less than the 1.8 PSI that your justification found. no one is denying that cold weather lowers relative pressure. we are arguing that it doesnt change the amount of air inside a ball.

regardless, bill nye agrees, so you are pretty fluffed. it is bill nye bro.

How long were they inside before they were tested at halftime? The only reason they were taken in is to be tested, no? I don't know the policy if they take the game balls inside normally. If the only reason they were taken in was to test them, i doubt they would let them sit for 20-30 mins first. I would test them right away, unless ya know, i had to go to the bathroom first. ;)

what I am saying is that the "scientific" experiment shows it was plausible.

and we have yet to hear what they Colts balls weighed. If we DID, we would also understand where the Patriots balls were relative to that. the colts balls, in this situation, COULD be "control" as you want. how much did they drop? what were they at originally, what were they at after the game.

The NFL gave us the #s on the patriots balls, what are the #s on the Colts balls, THAT would be telling information that is being withheld in lieu of "they were found legal". How much, if any, did they drop? Did they drop at all? where did they start at and end at? all pretty important things for citing them as "damning" evidence of the pats misdoings. We dont know what happened to the Colts balls, if anything. That is all I am saying.

Give me the #s and take the science out of the equation.

As I said, until I see the figures that the media is reporting were taken before, at halftime and at the end of the game they are innocent in my eyes. We have seen the numbers of the patriots balls, we have seen that it is plausible that it MAY have occurred naturally due to the elements, where are the numbers on the Colts balls. THAT would put the story to rest, but we don't see them... Why? because it would end this "crisis" and we couldn't ever let a good crisis go to waste.

the refs felt both the colts and pats balls at some point in the game before halftime, and determined that the pats balls were softer to the point to where they needed to be further investigated.

granted, this is subjective, and not exact numbers, but that in itself should be enough to tell you there was a noticeable difference in the balls that were supposed to have only a 1 PSI difference at most.

yes, numbers would make this concrete, but in leiu of them, these events point towards the fact that the patriots balls were much lower than the colts. in the same conditions. that is damning.

Oh and just in case you needed any more evidence that the NFL really knows how to f up an investigation they wait till today to say that they don't write down the pressure of football's when they check them before games. Basically they just use the feel test and approve or disprove them, so really the ref just holds the balls and says "Yeah that feels about right, I've handled a lot of balls in my day and this ball feels just right (It's ok to let your inner 12 year old laugh)". The more information that comes out the less I can approve of an NFL punishment for the Pats. I mean if you don't even check to make sure teams are within the legal limit how can you punish someone for being out of the approved range?

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/...f-each-patriots-football/

the refs checked the balls because the colts complained about them, not because they felt they were too soft, IF that were the case they would have tossed all 11 balls that were flat out of play(as they were all "excessively flat", to the same extent), they didn't. Only the one that was complained about. This was prompted by the Colts, not the refs.

which again, I would like the see the weight of the colts balls at each stage of measurement to compare the 2 teams balls. that would put it all to rest. So far we only have seen one side. which frankly, damages the credibility by doing so.

all it would take is for the NFL to say look, this is how much the colts balls dropped, this is how much the pats balls dropped, clearly the pats cheated. but they haven't, and i highly doubt they will. as long as this is in the news....$$$$$$$$$. and i dont think that the pats did do it. so far the evidence is sketchy at best.

i would like for you to explain how the NFL is making money off this controversy.

i like your hyper capable view of the NFL despite all evidence from the dumb fluff they have done this year saying otherwise. it is cute.

http://teamstre.am/1yp9bfB

nice summary of events to date there

so ford - is this not true?

"Colts’ Mike Adams says Deflategate is a non-story to him and his teammates.
Colts safety Mike Adams wanted to keep the footballs as souvenirs, not evidence.

Those who have traced Deflategate back to the November night against the Patriots when the Paterson native intercepted Tom Brady twice in a prime-time regular-season game are falsely reading too much into what actually happened and why.

His desire to save the balls had nothing to do with air pressure, rather to preserve the memory of his performance under pressure on a big stage against an iconic quarterback.

“I had just picked off Tom Brady on ‘Sunday Night Football,’ I’m freaking thrilled, running to the sideline, flip the ball to our equipment manager and ask him if he could put that away for me,” Adams told The Record after he participated in the first Pro Bowl of his career here Sunday night. “There was nothing suspicious about those footballs. First I heard [allegations] of that was after the fact, after our playoff game when the report came out. A report said it started all the way back to me, and that just wasn’t true.”


?????

Just because he didnot raise the concerns doesn't mean the equipment manager, someone far more familiar with balls and proper inflation, didnt.

Take those blinders off homie. I'm just posting what I read.

and then there's this...

"D'Qwell Jackson didn't notice weight.
Indianapolis Colts linebacker D'Qwell Jackson said it wasn't him who raised the concerns about New England's footballs being underinflated during Sunday's AFC Championship Game.

After Thursday's Pro Bowl practice at Luke Air Force Base in Glendale, Arizona, Jackson said he couldn't tell whether the ball he intercepted in the second quarter of a 45-7 loss to the New England Patriots was or wasn't deflated below the threshold allowed by the NFL.

"I'm a linebacker, I'm a defensive guy," Jackson said. "If anybody recognized anything it definitely wouldn't come from me.""


did you miss those two stories or have their been new developments?
i'm pretty sure you just posted erroneous and disproven stuff

ah ok i reread your post, i guess it doesn't say that adams thought they were deflated, just that he wanted to save it. but still...

and man i'm new england to the death, i'll keep throwing them at you guys :p

the d'qwell jackson stuff may be untrue though, at least he says so

Lol use that brain of yours in this stupid situation. Both of your posts pretty much let you know that it was the equipment manager that raised the concerns. Someone who would have been informed of other teams concerns as well. Defensive players more than likely would not have.

There are 2 red flags in Jay Glazers report...

1) he reported that Da'Qell Jackson alerted the equipment manager, and Jackson flat out denies he did that, with an explanation with it as well.

2) The NFL was planning on investigating the balls at halftime before the game even started and still didn't have the testing done by the end of halftime? I find that hard to believe. it is sticking a pressure gauge into 12 balls, that does not take an entire halftime to do.

Additionally, they swapped out the kicking ball? "According to the source, the backup balls were tested and found to be at the correct levels, and subsequently put into play—just barely in time, as the second half already had started by the time the testing was completed. This is why the officials stopped play and swapped out the kicking ball on the first play from scrimmage of the second half."

Solid reporting by ESPN. They stopped play to swap out the kicking balls because they stop play to swap them after every time the ball is kicked. That is common knowledge that there are 2 different sets of balls, kicking balls and playing balls.




I am still waiting to see the PSI levels of the Colts balls at each point the Patriots balls were tested to compare...

im waiting for the Pats to be Superbowl Champs!

breaking news, irrefutable evidence!

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=12252086

lol. Bill Nye and Neil Degrasse Tyson dissagree!

Seriously, is this Vic? Logged into a different account? Or are all Pats fans really this stupid?

is*

http://www.nytimes.com/...their-side-after-all.html

Still doesn't explain the colts balls, or account for the re-equalizing that more than likely took place during halftime.

No one is denying that atmospheric conditions affect the balls, they are questioning why identical conditions had differing effects on 2 separate sets of balls. Keep posting your links that dont explain that and nothing will be solved lol.

To my knowledge, which hasn't really touched actual sports sites for info, all the stuff before that only accounted for half the drop in pressure due to bad math and not real testing.

What's the big deal!! Patriots are notorious cheaters and the NFL heads are either ignorant or cheaters themselves.

Ok first off I'm a Seahawks fan. Secondly what I was trying to say is that if you don't record the ball pressure before the game how can you say the footballs were ever inflated to the proper pressure? And if you cannot say that the footballs were ever inflated to the proper inflation that means that the NFL approved under-inflated footballs for play. At any rate I just feel like the NFL really blew this whole investigation.

Also that analogy is pretty extreme, a better one would be: If you check something and approve it, but do not record the necessary information how can you prove that you actually checked the item properly and did your job?

Welcome back Frodo, but with all due respect...fluff the Seahawks and Patriots ;-)

Call it a hunch, but I think KoH might be hinting that he likes a team that will be lucky to break .500 next season due to a horrible front office. I'm thinking dennis erickson bad for them next year

Pats 107 seahawks 14.

Seriously though, GAME DAY, good luck seahawks fans, and fluff deflategate, its so boring im not even going to troll it anymore.. This is the best sunday of the year, enjoy!

GAME DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Two most hated teams in the league and a bunch of crappy bud light YOLO commercials. Not my favorite Sunday this year

Best case: Brady gets hurt first play of the game, Garoppolo comes in and him and the Patriots D destroy Seattle. That way Seattle doesn't get back to backs and I don't have to listen to their ridiculous fans, and Brady's quarterbacking talent gets put into proper perspective in Belichick's system

As promised :p

Also as promised - NFL concluded only 1 of 12 balls was "under inflated" when checked, not 11 out of 12 as had been erroneously stated multiple times in this thread. It was also concluded the amount the 1 ball was deflated by could certainly have been attributed to atmospheric conditions.

under weight, and under inflated, are not the same thing chief. the NFL hasnt released fluff yet as far as i know. I know there was a report on NFL.com that said that only one was more than 2 PSI low, and that the other 10 were just a little low, but that was nothing official. not yet.

Has there been any evidence the colt's balls weren't impacted the same? This again is why this is a non story, there was a football game played and there might have been some issues to all balls or someone's balls but we don't know. Why anyone has gone beyond that, other than the physics guys showing that 2 pounds of pressure lost is about right...

if you steam the games you get them without commercials! Sadly they tried to show a the halftime show, what kinda bastards do that?

I don't know... no commercials might have actually made this one better

http://youtu.be/OqHYYBRxY-s

halftime show almost made it better, but Katy Perry didnt do enough bouncing

ttt

i think in fifteen years this is the longest thread i have ever created..

i also stopped on page one, i think..