Can I get an Evo contact.

Furious
FA One Man's Army

Message Suncrusher.

Thank you Alin, that is most helpful.

you can find me in #irc.

you must be the busiest FA on the server, suncrusher :P

doubtful, Evo is only attacking untagged, OMA, and STONES!

The latter of which are at war!

I was kinda hoping to get some tips on Cookie Crushing.

But tellarion has been in touch so I guess that is for another day.

Meanwhile we are very flattered by all these spies dropping by. But really, guys, all you have to do is ask.

Yes we have VERY LITTLE LAND (note that point particularly please) and yes, we are pretty beat up, thanks to the CLOSE attentions of STONES. So if you want to drop round for tea and crumpets you are welcome but if you want to come and make grabs, well for shame! Tell your FA guys to put us on war DNH instead.

Azz kikr you play Alliance?

for quite a while lj :P

i was mostly referring to the fact that alin keeps sending everybody's FA requests to him (her?). regardless of the source or destination :P

Whisper - Alin is a little bit weird, Azz. Humour him if you can. :)

Azz Kikr what clan are you in?

Suncrusher is a "her". At least that`s what i heard - that she receives roses ...

Ah! That explains the obsession.

Send her a few more roses Alin. Always very acceptable. :)

But perhaps not quite so many requests for FA contacts. She can, after all, allways contact someone who needs a contact all by herself?

suncrusher is the head FA for all of alliance.

Confirmed

-Rattlehead
server aFA

re-confirmed

denied.....

!!!Cat fight!!!

Since they and LaF are grabbing STONES also I think it all balances out

So, a 5 and a 6 country alliances are fighting, with no police, and furious is mad about landgrabs?

Don't you know these netters are so dumb fluff obsessed with racing to max land they don't give a fluff? They would grab their own momma's country if they could come out ahead. Netters fluff about long wars making longtime players leave, but completely ignore the bottom feeding that prevents new players from breaking into a already hard to grasp game. It is because the bottom feeding doesn't affeCT them unless it is a suicider, so why would they care? It is hypocritical and how fluff has been for a long ass time. This community isn't mature enough to move past that, or change the way they play because the game is dying. Get police, or give up. You will be farmed.

lj: laf

Bottom feeders are rather grubby characters, there is all sorts of muck and decomposing stuff down there, wouldn't want a bottom feeder to come too close to the olfactory equipment, I think.

But people play as they like and I am glad they are here running their countries. They are very far rom having things their own way all the time. So their grubby habbits can produce amusement. :)

Leaving people to war in peace used to be thought a good thing to do and, if my memory serves, there was a high proportion of players who stuck to that including members of all the reputable clans.

But opinions seem to have changed. One or two of the better clans responded to my request fotr a war DNH but most ignored it.

I would be interested in how many, if any at all, think the old way was better? If people did think that and were to ask their FA or leadership to be more generous with war DNH that might change things a bit.

For what it is worth, OMA will not hit a country at war unless the country has not for some time visibly participated and appears from its news to be netting. That policy limited targets pretty dramatically last set but happily a couple of small wars of our own came along to enliven the set.

True mr ford and the only recourse to botto feeders has always been missiles up their arse
Then the bottom feeder goes crying and his tag farms or kills the missile tosser
That's the tradition here and it's a sad thing.
There's few that welcome small and newbies to try to protect and recruit
Maybe there is a need for tags like OMA and STONES to actually try to be true spam tags and try to give people homes in this game.

To get a war dnh, you should probably ask people directly. Speaking as an FA, I give DNHs to unpacted alliances out of courtesy if they are a legit tag. To your credit, you have been acting a lot more legit than guys like Outlaw/Undertaker/Fazer.

If you want tips on how to make a new alliance and make it stick, go talk to DK or Danger. They both had to go through the same fluff, and the reason few people mess with them(aside from yourselves last set I guess?) is because they know how to deal with people, and they can retal.

Get some bigass commies, prove to everyone that you aren't all bark and no bite, and people will treat you seriously.

Thank you for the advice.

Is Evo willing to put OMA and STONES on War DNH for the remainder of our scrap?

Speaking as a grubby bottomfeeder and, more importantly, a former alliance leader:

The alliance server has always been a place where you have to earn every little damn thing. No offense Blade, but when I see you complaining about how bad bottomfeeders are after you leave your cozy tag protection all I can think of is that you are taking the work that everyone did establishing RAGE (and every other tag in the game) for granted. No one gave them any handouts, and if a helping hand was offered you can be sure that whoever extended it wanted something in return.

More than that, it should be pretty obvious what steps need to be taken if you want to get a DNH: you find someone to police for you, and you personally contact the FAs from the alliances you want a DNH from. Not everyone reads AT, not everyone checks other people's news. If you want something, do the damn work and have some respect for the people who put in the time to facilitate these kind of things.

If you don't get police and you don't contact the FAs, you're not acting like a real tag and shouldn't be surprised when you get treated that way.

Edit - Regarding bottomfeeding supposedly ruining the game and driving away players:
I've been hearing this same complaint since about 2001, when the game was on the upswing. While it may drive away some players, the competitive nature of the server that drives this kind of thing is also exactly what attracts and retains people. Not only that, but bottomfeeders are far more likely than others to actually have contact with new players who are otherwise isolated. It isn't hard to tell who the new players are and point them in the right direction when you're looking at their countries more closely than anyone else would.

Everyone likes to complain, no one wants to do the work needed to make things happen. If you want to help new players, message untagged countries and recruit them. If you want DNHes, take the steps needed. Don't complain that other people aren't doing what you think they should.

Has someone been nasty to you to-day, iccyh?

No, I'm the nasty one :P

I'm getting kind of tired of people being so quick to criticize and point fingers, though, especially when it is the same recycled drivel that's been wrongly spouted basically since RockFamily and RockCorps came into existence and the country search tools it provided introduced bottomfeeding to the game. Maybe I'm being unfair to unload on Blade specifically (ford is no better), but it is frustrating to see the appeal of the game so completely misunderstood. We've never attracted and kept the kind of people that didn't, for one reason or another, like the competition that is inherent in the game.

Bottom feding existed from the inception of the game.

What has changed is its vigour.

Which comes, like the equally distasteful land trading, and hitting clans at war for that matter, from the scarcity of land.

I agree with you. There is room for all of us, top feeders, bottom feeders, suiciders, warriors and netters. We all need each other to make it a varied and interesting game.

Getting your own back on a fat and complacent LaFer, SoFer, Evo, whatever, is very satisfying. It would be far less fun if they made single taps like gentlemen. :)

And that's why I didn't lump you in there: it really does take all kinds to make the game work, and there is absolutely room for us all.

That said, it looks like you're saying that bottomfeeding is more prevalent now than it was previously. You have to remember that back in the day exploring wasn't a viable strategy so everyone grabbed, and most of the people who grabbed bottomfed. The difference is that back then, the multies and bots created room for new players to hide to some degree, but it honestly isn't like that was any better than it is now.

Regardless of how you grab, you're going to always hit a person (unless you're hitting a bot, and that's a different kind of issue altogether) and that is a fundamental part of the game. This isn't anything that has ever changed and honestly, I have a difficult time making a moral judgment about one grabbing style or another when considered in that light.

Iccy
Not at all complaining , just pointing out the obvious
OMA and STONES asked for a quite simple thing a war DNH in this an otherwise apparent server wide net round.
But too much for large tags to let slide I suppose .
You of all people remember how it was with grabs , take two and move along. More than that , do so at your own peril.
But now it's demoralize a few times grab 3-4, come back in a few and do it again.
That's the way to help the game?
What if it was you as an in tagged seeing that everyday? Makes you want to continue?
Who cares right? Not me anymore, done caring.

You know why it used to be double taps at most?
Because bots and multies flooded the server making bottomfeeding incredibly easy, alliances didn't trust their members not to get greedy and hit tags that actually mattered (which is reasonable when you're talking about tags of hundreds of people), and because in the days before retal policies were solidly established alliances were concerned about avoiding challenges to their policies. Alliances did that kind of stuff because it was practical at the time rather than because they were good sports of any kind.

Large tags barely exist anymore while smaller ones and even untagged countries have so much leverage compared to the past. All you have to do get protection is appear to be reasonably competent and generally play by the rules of the FA game.

The only tag getting hit like you're describing is STONES, and the main reason that's happening is because you didn't do what you needed to make sure you'd be protected.

might makes right diplomacy yeah that's the way

Too bad yall have gotten the game so screwed up, yall don't even have a clue what your talking about.

I played in TheFIST. We had a policy of single taps, untagged and tagged alike.

Not a single one of your reasons applied. It was done so as not to spoil anyone's set.

No offense to the memory of TheFIST as they were a good group, but if I recall they were usually around 40-80 members on a server where most of the top 20 alliances were 100-300. They weren't ever a major influence on policy, so I don't personally find that one example relevant.

Even then, though, you're describing a small alliance picking the least offensive landgrab policy possible. While it may indeed have been picked because the leadership and membership was genuinely concerned about the people they were hitting, it also had the convenient benefit of minimizing conflict and keeping them out of wars they'd likely lose.

Exactly right Iccy
I just figured a WD thread was still good around here and people would cut tags some slack
But instead it's just more of the same
S'ok it's pointless to continue here

What you say about ThFIST is substantially correct. It was a medium sized alliance but it had very strong long standing relationships with one or two of the biggest.

The policy of only ever single tapping had little to do with staying out of wars that couldn't be won, no-one makes multiple taps on an alliance two or three times your own alliance's size. But it must be right that the policy kept friction even with the bigger clans down. What it certainly did is completely to eliminate suiciders. We did not even operate a kill squad.

We had an occasional misile lobbed at one of our coutries by a new player and what they got was a polite message explaining that missile retals are not generally gone in for and that please not to do it again. Worked fine.

It takes the edge off your netgaining. None of us achieved the No. 1 spot while I was there but we challenged for highest average networth every netting set.