Poor "Dog Hanlong" :P

(to early for jokes) ?

.edit. nvm

+1

Chevs, this is only the latest in a history of Laf cheating that goes back a very long time. Dons that were known colors, Grammy, UCN being botted out of the game at Laf's request, now this. Its starting to call into question whether Laf has every truly cared about being clean.

I do NOT think Sof cheated, nor does anybody else in PDM leadership, but we do know that when hanlong was giving his 'opinion' on the timing of our potential FS, that he was getting it by reading our leader boards. Did you guys need the help to win against PDM? Of course not, but over the last 4-5 sets Sol, Evo, Pdm, and MD have all been repeatedly stomped on by the Laf-Sof coalition and now we find out that Laf had a huge unfair advantage in those wars. Can you at least understand why a lot of people are:

A - pissed off,
B - lumping you guys in with Laf,
C - some other third thing.

You guys may have been unwitting co-conspirators, but Laf could not have succeded without Sof's muscle backing their play.

Chevs: MY point is these two are not the first leaders in LaF to be massive cheaters. This has basically been a pattern of LaF leadership going back a decade. They have had more leaders get outted as cheaters then any other single alliance by quite a large margin. If you'd like a bit of a list:

hanlong
Turtle Crawler
Ronnie
Peanut
Mr. Shadow
Viper
Gramberto

What other alliance has a police lineup like that in their history?

I don't know how this thread got so insane. My original post, was to try and get a response from SoF, being as they ARE the most visible allies to LaF. If you re-read it, part of what I was hoping to find out was to what extent hlw violated SoF as well. My entire reasoning for this is for as much as possible to get out in the open, so that the community as a whole can get some closure and to shut down a lot of the conjecture out there. Personnally, I have already seem some of the paranoia that an event like this causes players, and would like to be able to start quelling those concerns in people.

IX

they hate LaF more than they hate "cheating". lol.

Maybe other people do. But I don't. I'm just calling a spade a spade and pointing out that LaF leaders do this fluff constantly and then the alliance tries to play it off as rogue members before appointing a new cheater to run the alliance and start it over again.

One of your dumbest posts. Let me clarify:

+0 Ivan spamming old members + new leadership + Rage = 100 members
+1 We lose a war where we were outnumbered that lasted all reset and caused leadership to burnout + Rage loses more members with infighting
+2 Rage leaves to start anew, as was planned when they merged in
+3 Tired of dumbasses on the boards, the leadership shrinks further and only Ivan and Chevs remain active + I retire
+4 After talk of RD organizing a coalition against us and begin told that SOL would drop us, a coalition is organized in which SOF petitions LAF, MD, LCN to join - Detmer can confirm he was offerred inclusion in this and I did most of the initial organizing as an exit strategy for my retirement. Scorpion returns giving us an active site admin.
+5 someone else can comment as I was not even watching the game
+6 Sov is made head and a major effort is made to revitalize the alliance and Helmet takes stronger command
+7 like +0, another mass spamming of old membership occurs. The site is cleaned out and unnecessary old access is stripped (including mine).

While I will not refute that SOF benefited from a relationship with LAF and other allies that were organized before +4, it is on you to substantiate benefits from LAF cheating. Your logic is half assed at best dagga. You are a mud slinger.

Since you cannot make your own point, I will do it for you. SOF benefitted from a larger and more organized LAF. Two coalitions emerged at the beginning of reset +4 and, unfortunately for SOL, they had beaten up on numerous defenseless alliances and had tarnished the goodwill of the server towards them. On the other hand LAF, LCN, PDM and to a lesser extend imag (who were mad at SOF for not having dropped SOL sooner in their defense) were all mad at you. You were beaten to the punch in making allies with newly formed MD and, aside from having an x-WOG head in SOF, Rival was unpleased with your treatment of them in their return reset as well. You paved the way for what happened to you by playing, wreckless, selfish politics.

I find it very doubtful that if LAF had not cheated that things would have unraveled much differently. Bully politics is what got you in the hole and it is what has LAF in the hole now. The difference is that hanlong and TC crossed a line and cheated. They are unforgivable but you are still an ass. You have no concept of how the past has unfolded to the present.

i don't think Son Goku is a cheater. as far as LaF (SG) is concerned, they have made their apologies and they have made some "measures" on their part. they even offered up some help to the admins. what else does the whole anti-LaF campaign wants? that i'm not sure. hope they don't bring the game down more than LaF does. i hate people who do more "trash-talking" than standing up to their points.

if anybody or whoever wants to destroy LaF, do it in the game not with all those trash talks and crying over AT.

the funny thing orkin is the most of the people posting here on AT telling SOF we are guilty by association are all known cheaters or ex cheaters.

which to me is more than hypocritical. Anyone who is caught cheating and or doing anything close to breaking the game rules is blacklisted in SoF.


@archaic, people have always and sadly it seems like will alwayts receive "ill gotten information" in this game, where it be through

leaks
spies
or the worst case, hacking/admin abuse

There is a distinct difference between these ways of getting infromation and "Breaking the game rules." If you think hanlong and TC are/were the only people doing this sort of stuff you are sadly wrong. LaF players have had their emails hacked, private conversations have ended up in the hands of evo numerous times, somehow evo have LaF's complete country listing..etc etc I could go all day.

Nobody makes a big stink aobut these other things though and its downright hypocritical.

This isn't actually about LaF. It's about SOF who supported and continues to support LaF while claiming to hold themselves to the highest ethical standards, which is a logically inconsistent statement.

Chevs: *I* am not and have never been a cheater though. I have probably been one of if not the most anti-cheater person this game has ever seen. As far as other alliances doing this I've railed against many many other alliances besides LaF. Ask ZEN how hard I slammed FBI for Vic :P

+1 to aponics post

Alliances are not people. Leadership in LAF just changed. Isolating SOF from a major ally would not benfit SOF and it wouldn't make any statement against cheating. Your logic is flawed ORKIN. SOF made a statement against cheating and they made one against Halong and TC. They also made one against Slagpit when he was giving game information (to a lesser extent) to EVO.

i'm not talking on behalf of SoF, just my own opinion:

SoF adheres to their standards, you can join them to find it out, BUT i believe they don't mingle with "politics" on AT. if SoF is to make a point, they do it in the game.

as far as LaF is concerned, i condemn cheating. but i don't condemn the whole alliance, only those who are involved. same goes to every alliance out there whose leaders have cheated in the past.

i think ^ he means don't condone cheating :P

At some point repeated leaders of an alliance being outted as cheaters becomes "the alliance" and not "people". My logic is not flawed. While I do not advocate LaF disbanding or being tagkilled they politically rightfully SHOULD be isolated right now. SOF is propping them up by standing by them. People say Son Goku isn't a cheater, I sure as hell don't know that. I know people said the same thing about the new leader of LaF every other time someone got ousted for being a cheater and yet their leadership started cheating again.

lol. wrong word used. changed condone to condemn, my english dictionary has malfunctioned.

Chevs: I would submit to you that the only difference in SOF's response to both Elitez and LaF is simply the fact that it is politically expedient to prop up LaF. When Elitez leaders were caught cheating was SOF not at the forefront of tag killing them? Now that an ally is caught cheating "It's people, not the alliance"

Is somebody going to ban aponic or what? That is a CLEAR lie.

Now he's trying to drag evo through the mud by accusing us of getting info from a developer? Where's the proof?

lol. hope Son Goku can prove me right or else i'm gonna eat my word. and yes, i agree with you that LaF should be isolated. let the investigation flourish and wait for final results, for proofs/evidences of who else were involved and the damage done. most people here on AT have a lot of allegations against LaF instead of "isolating" them and handing them over to the investigation team. all i see in their posts are purely politics and campaign against LaF. is that how alliances deal with alliances who crashed them in the past? i really have no idea what's going on in EE because this is my first reset since the game moved from Earth2025. lol.

Well, the Big 6 who hit Elitez were MD, Omega, Rage, TIE, UCN, and Rival (if I remember correctly). I am not sure if SoF fought Elitez.

The big 6 was pre sof i think anyway I dont see how Hanlong/TC cheating made them win a war where they had 30% number advantage and the FS which was the point that was made

You don't see anything Ivan. You're honestly one of the dumbest alliance heads I've ever had the pleasure of insulting.

How was Big 6 pre-SoF? The Big 6 reset was in ~2001. If I remember correctly, SoF was loosely allied to Elitez. Maybe an LDP?

And you are correct, hlw/LaF did not need to cheat in order to win this war against SoL or last reset against MD. But hlw didn't just want to win, he wanted to humiliate his enemies so they would never dare to challenge his superiority.

Pre SoF? No it wasn't. SoF was Elitez's ally, that's why they didn't participate. (same goes for IX)

That's some great high moral standard company SOF keeps there. LaF, Elitez, and IX

What the fluff are you talking about chevs? If by first post, you mean Pang's announcement about the scandal, he only mentions SoF to say that Hanlong may have had access there for whatever reason and that if you guys aren't aware of it, you could look into it. Yeah, that's so politically oriented against SoF...

Also, to be fair, Pang's view on warring alliances who gangbang or bully netters has never changed (you could argue whether SoF fits that case for this last set or two, but it's not relevant here). There were long diatribes about it when he was still with LaF. For the most part, he doesn't post about it on AT anymore, but that does not mean his opinion changed in the last two sets.

You are obviously having issues with what "objective admin" means: if pang were to look at SoF's countries through the database, gift PDM players military/stock, or read SoF's private messages, etc that would be a nonobjective admin. As it is, admins are allowed to have political opinions because they are also players which, as has been mentioned repeatedly, is the reason why they decided to create EE in the first place.

I said I think sof was pre the big 6 since theres no recollection of that event in our history board at all and I didnt start playing earth seriously until 02

ORKIN, I like you more and more each day.

+1

I feel the same way as archaic, could not have called it better ORKIN.

oh noes being offended on at

i insult you too Ivan. lol. you should not put "i think" on your posts next time.

yeay, we're still going!

Sof have form here. They were the most outspoken elitez allies in the game. They depended on elitez to win several wars - one of which there is a log that still might be floating around where helmet is literally begging startiger for FA. He was personally matching up Sof and elitez countries in a 1v1 war they had with SOL.

Sof kept accepting protection from elitez right to the bitter end until the Anthony ciolli logs surfaced and showed that elitez were running hundreds of multies, running bots and sharing logins. The rest of the community knew they were cheating - every country was logging on to stonewall. Sof however, and yes helmet was running the show, turned an absolute blind eye and grasped at their support like a drunk grasps at a whiskey bottle.

The next time helmet brings up his sob story about being botted, ask him why he was the last alliance leader to disown elitez

rofl@dagga

god yer so full of fluff sometimes

So why didnt SOL fight elitez? sounds like you had reasons too? and yer so anti cheating arent ya?

Yer a fluffin hypocrite in an alliance lead by an ex cheater, get that fixed and then you can talk

F L U F F

So when someone says fluff or fluff does it automatically get changed to fluff?

Apparently so

Dagga is back to lying. Whew. I'm glad the universe has righted itself. I was really concerned.

cgr4, you can alter that in Options by the EE logo at the top of the forums. There's a swearfilter checkbox.

@cgr4 only if you have the swear filter enabled. You can disable it as Terius said:P

wanna war again we are ready anytiuime

bonus..post..

First on page 4!

No denial from helmet. If he is the anti multi crusader he masquerares as, an apology for that disgraceful period in sof's history should be forthcoming

I'm so sorry that you're so stupid and misinformed.

Would really like just to fs sol cause of dagga flapping his gums