Main stream media is blacking out the real situation for the 'occupiers' of wall street.

http://rt.com/...treet-police-protest-433/

"This government is not working for the best interest of its people or this nation"


my thoughts exactly

they are more interested in fighting amongst themselves then working to fix the problems in this country

I think its absurd that a country whose values were built on freedom of speech and the right to protest can get away with subverting people's rights in this way. It's even more sad that major news networks who's prime responsibility is to report stuff like this are shut up because stock holders have them by the balls.

The whole system is broken, and as per martian's post (http://forums.earthempires.com/...t-doesn-t-want-us-to-know ) it's the corporations running America. Your democracy has compromised.

Though it would most certainly not be pretty, I really think the American people need to take a MUCH harder stand on this. Too many sheep are letting it slide.

Problem is, people are so "thankful to have a job these days" that they won't dare take any time out of their days to do the research on what is needed to be done to force the government/wall street/whoever to fix the mess they've put us into. Let alone actually doing anything about it. Most anybody will do is make posts on the internet about what Wall Street is hiding from us and then say "do something about it!!!" LOL.

The media didn't cover the large anti-bush protest in nyc during the 2004 presidential election either.

Canadian media is somewhat different because of the three largest private media outlets, two are entirely privately held and one depends on local small business and residents to stay profitable. The 4th largest one (the Sun) is blatant partisan drivel but most of their readership is there only for the sports and the lingerie models anyway. It's not fantastic, but at least when no-name-tag police beat a protestor they splashed pictures of the officers all over the front page asking the police if that would help id the culprits.

I should say that the US has been here before (early 20th century). It works for a while, but when things go wrong everything tends to collapse.

When I hear "The Sun", I laugh and wonder how people still believe whatever they reports. LOL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtI6b6D-9Ck

Trader on BBC says Eurozone Market will crash [26 September 2011]

/me licks Ruthie ;)

i dont vote or listen to a damn one of them. all it is is garbage in and garbage out. its all about what gets them a better paying seat tomorrow

@diez: given that Brian Mulroney is on the Board of Directors the answer is they don't:P People just like the shiny pictures:P

Hmm in their defence, they have some good photographs at times, it's true :p

how them dang socialists can afford sitting around and complaining about people making money?

If the US leaned a little socialist, I think you'd probably see a much healthier population, better productiveness, healthier economy and slightly more responsible government. Why? Because when you invest in your population and nurture the seeds of growth in a positive way, good things happen.

People on their own get lazy and apathetic, then wonder where all their tax dollars go without seeing the benefits. In turn, it makes people distrust government even more.

--

Kemo: If you don't vote, then you're not helping the situation any. I hate most politicians too, but I know when I hit the polls, I at least have a right to complain when the government does something I don't like. If you don't vote, you have no right to complain.

we got insurance to cover all that socialist junk. some of it's even required by the state.

"If you don't vote, you have no right to complain"

I have heard this over and over again. I for one think you do have a right to complain even if you don't vote. you pay taxes if you work or even if you don't work you still pay sales tax to that gives you a right.

And who decides how those tax dollars are spent? People who were elected. Voting is a civil obligation, a privilege we are lucky to even have. If nobody voted, (many already don't), then we might as well be saying we don't care less if a dictator took over and turned the country into a country like China.

If more people voted, governments would be more likely to submit (or at least consider) the demands of the people. The less people that vote, the more governments will continue to walk all over us.

Hmmm


Time to blow stock, before the market goes to hell :)

if our government wasn't looking out for us, we wouldn't be able to smoke pot, steal music and movies, pirate software and make a general nuissance of ourselves.

There are many reasons for this (the corporations running America), and I would be here all night typing the history of it. It is very confusing, and you pretty much need a law dictionary to understand 90% of the corporate register, which is mistaken for our Constitution. The US Constitution hasn't technically existed since 1861, and wasn't replaced until 1871.

http://www.youtube.com/..._H5V0Kw&feature=share

The above video explains most of it. What he doesn't go into is the seizing of US Land up in through 1933-1940 that was really the final nail in the US peoples coffin (why we pay property taxes).

In short, all the events from 1861 up to the repealing of the Glass-Steagall Act in 1999 have greatly contributed to the situation we're in now.

But, my main point here is that the US people have little "rights" at all. If you register to vote, you actually "give up" your rights under the old constitution (which remember, doesn't really exist anymore) for a set of "privileges" to reap the benefits of being attached to the said system. Benefits such as social security, driving and professional licenses. Basically, it gives you access to the dollar. NukEvil hit the nail on the head here: most of the population is so glad to have that paycheck, that dollar, that iPhone, the new TV that they'll just let most of their rights go.

It goes SO FAR that in fact in order for our politicians to serve at the head of the system, THEY HAVE TO BE REMOVED FROM IT, and many are paid a substantial amount to let it ride out with tight lips. Best example to date: Tea Party. You want to talk about a political 180?????

Furthermore, through not just one, but several provisions in legislation from April 5, 1933 to the Bush era (2002 and up) US Citizens (the privileged) can, at any time be declared as enemy combatants and detained at the will of the United States so long as they have given up their rights to exist under a free constitution.

I'll leave it at that, I've droned on to long. Watch the above video, fire up the law dictionary (they may have one online) and do some research for yourself. You'd be surprised, shocked and appalled at what you'll find. More-so at what these banks can get away with now, that "we the people" have basically allowed them to do.

Schilling

Hmmmm yeah I never understood that thing with propiety taxes.

You own the house, but not the land where the house is build?

in all my trips to the US, I asked why it was like that there, and no one really gave me a real answer.

You can say all you want about my fluffty back water country, but at least I own the land in with I live.

they needed a cheap and efficient way to steal land.

you pay on the house too.you even pay more if you don't live in it or it is a rental property. the laws on property tax are crazy and very a lot from state to state. in Indiana i pay out the ass

The Wall Street bankers have built a financial construction so weak that a fart from half way around the globe can blow out the windows and tear off the roof.

Seems like we're at the point where the bean counters have brought in the moving van. They've pulled out their furniture and paid the movers with a good feed of beans, sans beano.

The imperfections of systems of governance, laws and economic frameworks built around older technologies amplify and soon grow out of control when new technologies are introduced.

The old model of law created to work with paper and courier communication is too slow and too incompatible to keep pace with immediate and accelerated electronic transmission.

We're seeing it bright and clear with the financial mayhem and engineering being undertaken. People who want to prevent problems aren't seeing them until the symptoms begin to show, until they are too embedded to remove. There are only a few with the vantage point to understand the consequences of their actions and they've shown no ability to self regulate, but only exploit.

Well, I guess maybe I should have ended that by connecting it better to this thread. The same technologies that allowed the people at the top who make/evade/change/enforce/defer making the rules to keep the playing field tilted a certain direction will also be the means by which their secret acts and abuses are unveiled.

I guess we'll see what we do about it as the information propagates and the story unfolds more clearly. My bet is that Americans are going to stay bent over and passive. Canada under Harper will soon join the party running in, bending over and screaming, 'Me too! Me too!'

No. Property taxes are one of the main sources of primary education funding in the US

why does it have to be that way just put on a school tax that way everyone pays not just the property owners.

you own the land and the buildings, unless you are renting it

property taxes on land are a lot cheaper than the taxes on any buildings on the land

If you own it, then why is the government entitled to tax your home?

You don't profit from it, you just live there.

Is like paying a tax for living in the US... and you already pay those at the gas station, the grocery store, the restaurant, every time you do a transaction...

Is a ball of cats to me, lack of complete and utter sense.

Why is the government forcing you to pay a tax on something that they don't put any kind of investment of state money?... they don't fix your home when something breaks, the propriety tax has nothing to do with the basic services you receive, as those are already paid by other taxes...

Really I don't understand :/

I am not sure in other states but in Indiana most of the property tax money is used for schools it is done on an assessed value

The city provides services like building roads. Where do they get this money? Is it magically produced from somewhere? Nope. Property taxes. You live in the city, you pay for the roads, by paying property taxes.

They've been around for a while. What they are used for is often used to substitute the WHY question. When you ask any official WHY you pay property taxes they will more than likely tell you WHAT they spend the money on, then the legalities behind it.

Short version is: The US Govn't defaulted twice in history. In order to raise (actually, PRINT) the money they needed, they needed to leverage something tangible (or real). So, they leveraged what the had close at hand, and plenty of: The land. Enter the property tax. Again, short version.

the property tax debate has been going on for a long time 1800s and before, there have been many attempts to reform property tax,but as with any tax when it is started it does not seem that bad because it is not a huge burden to start with, and increases with time.

Property tax is a wealth tax.

It is also the oldest and most historically consistent tax. It is also the major tax that is probably least complained about, from my experience.

well i complain plenty about it I pay several thousand dollars in property tax twice a year. and my kids are not even in school and i don't use the public library.there is a county tax also but it is not near as much as property tax.lets just do a county income tax to cover everything and drop all property tax.

that would create a disincentive to provide labour, increasing unemployment.

Property tax is a consistent, predictable source of revenue. It doesn't distort the market much compared to other taxes though.

A broad VAT would be better though... Would you be fine with replacing property tax with a retail sales tax?

yes i would sales tax =every one pays there share exempt food and med maybe a couple of other things but overall tax all goods and services

Dylan Ratigan is the best public voice regarding the evils of money in politics at present.

Instead of getting into the type of taxation, we need to have the debate about the services we want to possess - and let that determine the tax level. Because it's not just property tax.. it's sales tax, it's the gas tax, it's all kinds of cost in several different ways that combine to add up to the fees we pay for certain services. The main reason for this discussion is that the recent Republican technique is to agree to the services but then object to writing the agreed-upon check for those services.

they usually don't tax "essentials" like groceries.

You could argue that property tax everyone pays their share as well (except the homeless).

Well, it taxes rental property higher than residential. This means that higher taxes are placed on renters than on home owners. This then is a higher tax on the lower income and on the younger. Another perfect example of government using taxes to tell us how we should live.

Maybe they do where you live, but that isn't the case everywhere. Where I live for example there are 9 property classes (light industry, heavy industry, comemrcial, utilities, farm, etc.), and there is only 1 "residental" property class.

2/3rds of the US population don't seem to be requrired to pay income tax an you're worried about increasing unemployment?
how they get to collect unemployment if they don't make enough to pay income tax?

I didn't say anything about them collecting unemployment insurance, I said there would be more unemployment. They aren't the same thing at all.

I guess I should be more specific though.

Income tax increase won't effect the unemployment statistic as we know it. It will negatively impact the labour force participation rate.

lol, big deal. it's kinda nice that they won't be draining the system more, but what's it matter if they don't get a job, since we only need 1/3 of the population to pay for them?

errr.. the point is that out of various taxing options, income tax is one that happens to distort the economy a lot. As such it is less preferable to other modes of taxation.

How are people draining the system if they are working, or looking for a job, but then decide to stop working or stop looking for a job due to income tax increases?

Higher income taxes leads to more people deciding not to work at all, since more people will decide that the effort is no longer worth the purchasing power, or that other non-employment options are now more preferable. I don't see what that has to do with draining social services. You can only collect unemployment if you are laid off, not if you quit. Thus there shouldn't be any impact on that.

In summary: higher income taxes leads to fewer total labourers in the economy. Which in turn could force employers to raise wages in order to attract labour, which effects their marginal costs and reduces economic activity.

how are they contributing to the system if they don't make enough to pay income taxes? last i heard it was only 11k a year to be exempt. boom poverty level in the US. so, they a bunch of poor bastages.

If they are making below the threshold then they aren't contributing to taxes no, but does that mean that raises the tax rates (or lowering the threshold) is somehow going to positively impact the labour market?

Some of those people making < 11k a year may choose to stop working all together and collect welfare instead. Is it not better to not contribute and not collect, compared to not contributing but collecting? (on the assumption that some of these people that stop working will apply for welfare)

all's it tells me, is that i'm paying way too much money to support a bunch of freeloading bastages. doesn't even count my alcohol and tobacco taxes. getting time to hit the road.

Hit The Road Jack!
And Don't You Come Back
No more, No more, No more.
We'll starve Jack!
But Don't You Come Back!
No More, No More, No More.

This guy use to work in my company. Now hes a famous drug addict.

http://gawker.com/lotion-man/

Property taxes indirectly tax everyone. Everyone lives somewhere. Just because you rent doesn't mean you aren't paying property taxes -- its in your rent.

Property taxes are mostly used to support the services of local government (cities, counties) which support the population which lives on that land. Having revenue based on property taxes also properly aligns the interest of the state/local gov't in increasing the standard of living (and thus property values) in their geography.

Also, property taxes are harder to evade. Income tax and Sales tax are both frequently evaded with cash, barter, black market, under the counter, etc. transactions. When was the last time you gave/paid someone cash that they most likely didn't declare as income? I'll bet it wasn't long ago.

Property taxes also have the benefit of real collateral in the case of a failure to pay. Someone who owes back taxes can leave the country and perhaps never be caught. Their property isn't going anywhere though and can be confiscated.

I think there are lots of good reasons for property taxes. They are structured differently in different jurisdictions though, so I am sure we can point to better or worse implementations depending on your views of progressive or regressive taxation, incentive tax policy, etc.