An idea I had for speed hitting & readiness

qzjul

Administrator
Game Development
10,263

Apr 28th 2011, 20:59:49

So with regards to all this speed hitting and whatnot...

I had an idea for encouraging people to hit *slightly* slower, while still allowing rushing...

Idea was thus:

Make readiness lost = normal readiness lost + max(2 - seconds_since_last_attack,0)

That way if you rush hit you'd lose say 3% readiness instead of 1% readiness (or 6% instead of 4%, you know), but if you waited 1 second you'd lose 2% (instead of 1%) and if you waited 2 or more seconds you'd lose the normal amount (1% for example).

This would allow people to do 20 hits / second still if it was urgent that they rush somebody, but would encourage a little bit slower hitting if it was just a normal kill.

And we could display a 2 second cooldown now that we have javascript functionality...

Thoughts?

Finally did the signature thing.

ZIP

Member
3222

Apr 28th 2011, 21:03:37

with this new speed - there is no way to wall unless you are logged in when the first hits come in.
texting/ calling is too slow now

fluff your 300 Spartans fool - i have 32 of the biggest fluffed mother fluffers made of titanium !!
A brigade from Blackstreetboyz (#91) has invaded your lands! Your defenses held against the invaders and forced them away! Your military lost:1 Troops

kemo

Member
2596

Apr 28th 2011, 21:11:33

forcing a .2 delay between hits would do maybe a 1 min time to get on. thats enough time to get on if your hardcore enough

all praised to ra

Azz Kikr

Wiki Mod
1520

Apr 28th 2011, 21:12:15

i kinda like it at first read, qz. it gives opportunity for normal and speed hitting, and penalties for each.

Chaoswind

Member
1054

Apr 28th 2011, 21:26:58

Love it :)

Elysium Lord of fluff
PDM Lord of fluff
Flamey = Fatty
Crazymatt is Fatty 2

Marshal

Member
32,589

Apr 28th 2011, 21:31:25

we need to invent telepathy.

Patience: Yep, I'm with ELK and Marshal.

ELKronos: Patty is more hairy.

Gallery: K at least I am to my expectations now.

LadyGrizz boobies is fine

NOW3P: Morwen is a much harsher mistress than boredom....

dustfp

Member
710

Apr 28th 2011, 21:40:34

kemo: you're*

btw, I like this idea qz :p

-fudgepuppy
SancTuarY President
icq: 123820211
msn:
aim: fudgepuppy6988
http://collab.boxcarhosting.com

ZEN

Member

EE Patron
1549

Apr 28th 2011, 21:52:58

I think you need to balance it out for the restarts. Getting people excited about restarting would make war a little more exciting. Fast hitting is awesome. Unless you are on the receiving end.

Maybe accelerated turns for restarts?

anubis0079

Member
160

Apr 28th 2011, 21:58:11

i like walling against it. almost died but it gave me a nice challenge. time to get your game faces on ;)

SoLer for Life
"All Hail The Maki!"
Have a heart.....they are really fresh.

qzjul

Administrator
Game Development
10,263

Apr 28th 2011, 22:06:51

I'll see what pang thinks when he's back in the dev zone after italy ~~

Finally did the signature thing.

Jiman

Member
1199

Apr 28th 2011, 22:21:49

Ill like this idea if there was some way to know when to attack again and avoid losing this.

I dont want to try to attack quickly and be forced to go to slow.

Makinso

Member
2908

Apr 28th 2011, 22:38:59

Honestly I don't agree Zip.

And I don't agree with the post either Qzjul. There are so many more tools available nowadays that allow you to get your players on to wall.

We've been getting plenty of SOLers online in time. It just depends on if you use the new tools EE gives you properly.

dagga

Member
1559

Apr 28th 2011, 22:54:12

Plenty of wallers. Just get a bit more imaginative or make sure you're not an easy break.

signatures are stupid.
Months since LaF netgained: 22

Makinso

Member
2908

Apr 28th 2011, 23:04:34

What the fact that we agree with each other ?

Or the fact that we have so many wallers :-P

haha

iTavi

Member
647

Apr 28th 2011, 23:08:02

there are many wallers indeed. i doubt sol peeps have trouble with the new attack, they don't seem bothered by it. some even buy up seconds prior to the start of the killrun :P

Makinso

Member
2908

Apr 28th 2011, 23:44:15

:-)

Like we said tavi be inventive with the new tools given to you by EE.

Yheti

Member
57

Apr 28th 2011, 23:49:10

I don't know if this'd be too intense for the servers (speaking of which, I assume they're dedicated?) but maybe make the speed hitting readiness loss change depending on how many countries have attacked the country within the last 30 mins? Too complicated?

I just feel like otherwise this'd benefit large alliances when they're attacking smaller ones, making it a bit one sided.

Klown

Member
967

Apr 28th 2011, 23:52:14

Yeah I don't know. How would you know for sure when 2 seconds had passed?

braden

Member
11,480

Apr 28th 2011, 23:53:53

i think it is a lot of fun. I have only used it the once for an express kill, but it was exciting for the first time since i was fifteen.

BobbyATA

Member
2367

Apr 29th 2011, 0:01:19

B&S please!

Rolangunslinger

Member
193

Apr 29th 2011, 0:24:14

NO! leave it alone. It has been working for this long, why change it now.

Vic Rattlehead

Member
810

Apr 29th 2011, 0:28:41

Really, Bobby? You're going to presume to tell qz where to post his threads? WTF man...

Anyway, like.

NA hFA
gchat:
yahoo chat:

available 24/7

LittleItaly

Game Moderator
Alliance, FFA, & Cooperation
2188

Apr 29th 2011, 0:45:41

Leave it alone...

Too complex for noobs...

LittleItaly
SOL Vet
-Discord: LittleItaly#2905
-IRC: irc.scourge.se #sol
-Apply today @ http://sol.ghqnet.com for Alliance

Drow

Member
1666

Apr 29th 2011, 0:48:58

impossible to wall? bullcrap.
I can still wall successfully, from my phone no less, so long as I get at least a text. proved it when we got smacked by RD. I was walling just fine until my phone's battery died :P

Paradigm President of failed speeling

Chaoswind

Member
1054

Apr 29th 2011, 1:13:59

Phone walling is scary... you could be mistaken as a sex offender... you know looking at your cell phone in that way, screaming "take that fluff" and that massive boner... god most wallers will be in jail by the end of the week :)

Elysium Lord of fluff
PDM Lord of fluff
Flamey = Fatty
Crazymatt is Fatty 2

Drow

Member
1666

Apr 29th 2011, 1:19:14

add to that, riding on a bus or train :p
I do tend to get some funny looks when I have been phone walling in the past...

Paradigm President of failed speeling

aponic

Member
1879

Apr 29th 2011, 1:59:23

I like that the issue of speed hitting is reviewed, but I personally don't like any sort of delay timer. Hitting and walking away to real life is super.

SOF
Cerevisi

toma

Member
313

Apr 29th 2011, 2:02:25

I think the old way was better, where you didn't see the attack results. Since it was a bit risky and sometimes resulted in 20x def helds. Now there really isn't any badside to fast hitting.

Originally posted by Slagpit:

Ruining peoples fun for no reason is okay, but ruining it for a reason I disagree with isn't okay. Never change, community.

qzjul

Administrator
Game Development
10,263

Apr 29th 2011, 3:21:19

"And we could display a 2 second cooldown now that we have javascript functionality..."

so yes, we could display it so it would be visible when to hit next to avoid more losses

we need to write a poll function for here and in-game... it'd be easier to collect opinions :)

Finally did the signature thing.

toma

Member
313

Apr 29th 2011, 3:47:14

maybe have it so that it takes 2 seconds for the results to show up, but you can hit faster if you want to.

Originally posted by Slagpit:

Ruining peoples fun for no reason is okay, but ruining it for a reason I disagree with isn't okay. Never change, community.

Krue

Member
21

Apr 29th 2011, 4:22:33

I don't like this idea. Walling is still possible given the current setup. No need to change it.

dagga

Member
1559

Apr 29th 2011, 5:18:03

Just slow the actual hits down to 0.3-0.5 of a second? Javascript to disable the button until that time elapses.

I really like the current system, but I haven't had a chance to wall yet.

What about think a bit outside the box and creating something for stonewalling, similar to how the Market Orders are used. Say you can set up 2 or 3 "auto-buy" options that get displayed on the main page when you log in after being hit.

Say you're getting hit really hard, you login, you don't really have time to get to the market and buy up so you click "Autobuy Setting 1: $200m worth of troops" which is displayed on your Main Page as soon as you log in. Instead of dialing back the attacking option, can we improve both aspects at once?

Auto email on a failed spy op?

signatures are stupid.
Months since LaF netgained: 22

Helmet

Member
1341

Apr 29th 2011, 22:22:08

I would rather have the amount of time until you can hit again throttled, than getting a readiness penalty. Honestly though, I like things the way they are, but if they're too fast I think you just do something like on the search feature of the forums that says you can't attack again for 2 more seconds or whatever.

Alin is a cheater.

http://i1090.photobucket.com/...ainoftse/alincheating.png

TAN

Member
3231

Apr 29th 2011, 23:43:02

I say leave as is, but if your country is killed under 1 minute, your restart should get bonuses.

FREEEEEDOM!!!

aponic

Member
1879

Apr 29th 2011, 23:56:00

I like dagga's suggestion to have a "BUY x troops" button up immediately upon login. That would counter the new hitting speed without taking away from the ease-ability of playing.

SOF
Cerevisi

Junky

Member
1815

Apr 30th 2011, 0:03:42

Troops and Turrets

I Maybe Crazy... But atleast I'm crazy.

Steeps

Member
392

Apr 30th 2011, 0:18:34

I think speed hitting is already punished enough with millitary and oil losses for hitting so fast, wheras a regular break can save you so much in resources.

Wharfed

Member
384

Apr 30th 2011, 1:53:00

Yeah, not everyone is capable of speed hitting, and sometimes, its the only way to kill someone.

>Wharfed

ABOYNE (vb.) To beat an expert at a game of skill by playing so appallingly bad that none of his clever tactics or strategies are of any use to him.

Rick

Member

EE Patron
208

Apr 30th 2011, 2:38:17

Adding chrome to your rusty trumpet doesn't make it better.

enshula

Member

EE Patron
2510

Apr 30th 2011, 5:16:10

if you want a buy x troops button it should be based around

[attackingtroopslost / attackloss% - current troops] / (1/weapons) / (1/gov) * factor = troops to buy

where troops to buy is either a calculation based on the last person to hit yous gov and weapons or a guess based on same

that perhaps you could set

i also forget if med tech reduces attacking losses these days

but id much rather have walling changed so effectiveness didnt increase a lot by being online and being at a low pop as well as making kill runs not so fast (or at least reducing the arms race between killing quick and getting on quick by making getting on not as effective)

Mr Charcoal

Member
993

Apr 30th 2011, 7:36:21

1) The readiness lost is a great idea. It makes rush killing that much more painstaking. But instead of regular readiness lost if attack interval is longer....why not something like this?

For any war attack (GS/BR) The first hit is standard readiness loss, and every hit thereafter the interval comes in to effect. If you hit
1 seconds - readiness+2
3 seconds - readness +1
5 seconds - readiness
6+seconds - readiness-1

This leaves an added bonus for those careful / precision style attackers. And now if it comes to a rush kill, you have to weigh the consequences.

------------

The other item mentioned by ZEN (<3) was the idea of restart bonus. My initial thought is relevant only to Alliance/FFA.

If a tagged alliance is officially at war, the tag holder should be able to click a box stating that. Any time someone from that tag dies they can restart with 250 turns or something like that.

The only downfall is to monitor it as to not aid suiciders. If I go AB LaF and they kill me, i shouldnt be able to restart with 250. That would promote suiciding.

Originally posted by NOW3P:

Religion is like a penis - it's perfectly fine to have one, but you're best served not whipping it out in public and waving it in people's faces.

mdevol

Member
3228

Apr 30th 2011, 8:12:56

i say we eliminate the rushing button and replace it witha plant trees button!!

everybody go hug a tree and net net net!!

on the other hand i like daggas idea of a auto buy button on main page

even if you had to set it beforehand, it would be nice.

Surely what a man does when he is caught off his guard is the best evidence as to what sort of man he is. - C.S. Lewis

dagga

Member
1559

Apr 30th 2011, 8:15:38

I don't like the readiness proposal at all. The biggest issue with the fast attacks are when the defender has comparatively low defense to the opposing countries. If a defender has 2-3m troops with good med and weapons, fast attacking is really hurting the country doing it. Losing extra readiness on top of it seems like way too harsh a penalty for attackers.

Targets with decent defense are still taking several minutes to kill.

The biggest question is - what is a fair time to give a stonewaller to log on? THAT is what needs to be worked out. My suggestion is 2.5 minutes to get on before it is 80% dead. That would work out to be 120 seconds for 200 attacks.

signatures are stupid.
Months since LaF netgained: 22

enshula

Member

EE Patron
2510

Apr 30th 2011, 13:59:56

charcoal for bonus's to restart one simple idea is if you choose to receive bonus's then its obvious in some way who you are the restart of

that reduces a lot of the anonymity of suiciding

wouldnt hurt to put a cap on attacking losses if the whole rush/wall situation was changed to make both less effective

the idea of a game where always on internet and cpu's combined with automated alerts provides such a large efficacy bonus i think is dumb

theres no reason someone cant setup an equivelant netting bot telling you "quick logon now theres a target in your accepted tags list with low nw/a ratio and dr"

so not only should wall/rush be changed drcamping should be changed too

TAN

Member
3231

Apr 30th 2011, 16:17:38

What. Did ZEN mention the restart bonus before me?

FREEEEEDOM!!!

enshula

Member

EE Patron
2510

Apr 30th 2011, 16:43:42

there were threads on bugs and suggestions about it months ago, no idea who brought it up first though

it was in some of those threads about FS's being overpowered

Servant

Member

EE Patron
1249

Apr 30th 2011, 16:52:58

IF you go the readiness route, charcoal had some great ideas. However, give me a 100 member allaince with strong countries, and we'll wait 6-10 secs between hits to get readiness back but just send moer troops...as a result you can kill fast, and properly done, church out more hits too! And being earth, people would figure that out.

I still think the Java script route is better. (2 secs between hits imo...)

Properly coordinated, you can still get VERY quick kills,

Z is #1

Servant

Member

EE Patron
1249

Apr 30th 2011, 16:53:58

Oh, one thought.

I think missles should be excluded. they are often used to regain readiness, and having to wait 2 secs to fire a missle isn't a good thing.

Z is #1

aponic

Member
1879

Apr 30th 2011, 19:22:48

All this stuff with readiness needlessly complicates the game. It is as bad as the first bonus point system. Just make a buy x troops or x turrets on the main page as soon as a person logs in. Less walling levels the playing field in war. Adding all these crazy time delays etc is only going to add more leg work for alliance leaders, lengthen warchat times, and generally make warring more annoying and time consuming.

SOF
Cerevisi

Pain

Member
4849

Apr 30th 2011, 19:23:29

basically all this does is reward people with fluffty countries.

maybe the new attack setup will teach people to run better countries.

i was able to wall every kill run (that i chose to) that CC did on me in FFA. were tlking about people with bigger countries and more available countries to rush with.

if anything set up phone bot that sends a text to people when they are getting hit. dont penalize the skilled and organized.

Your mother is a nice woman