Err Hanlong didn't quit for RL reasons, though he did state he was quitting at the end if this reset (for game-politics reasons) you simply expedited the process.

Originally I thought you were receiving info from an ill informed source. But based on what you are saying now a out Hanlong, I have to believe that you are just talking out of your ass. Anyone who has even the most basic site access to LaF knows why Hanlong quit, as it is all over the boards

Rockman for the new LaF King!

no H4, actually Pang just said in chat hanlong was quitting for RL reasons. That's what I was basing it on. If that is incorrect then I revert back to my he did it for LaFs ANW/he is a bad FA incapable of dealing with things in a competent fashion.

No, what hasn't changed here is your insistence on ruining the game with your crap conspiracy theories and obnoxious personality. You thrive on drama and won't be happy until the entire community is polarized - it's an ongoing theme with you. You're just a drama queen who has to cause trouble. Like the scorpion, it's just your nature.

It'd be nice if you would, for once, stop campaigning for destruction.

yes *I* am the one ruining the game Patty with all of my game ruining AT posts no one has to read or respond to. Makes perfect sense.

You're bringing some old grudge against ORKIN and blaming him for scaring hanlong away when it's pretty clear to most players not in LaF or RD that:
1) LaF mistreated PDM, with the 17 hits in 24 hours being the start of the provocation (in "retaliation" for 2 hits by PDM on LaF)
2) LaF is probably working with RD here
3) RD is FSing PDM for a carppy reason
If pointing that out is spreading some sort of "conspiracy theory" then it seems most of the server have been fooled...

Also, if pointing out that RD's "Mr" countries farming players within the RD tag last set was against the spirit of the rules and probably against the letter of the rules (knowing their past) is driving away players or harboring old prejudices then once again, consider quite a few players guilty of this.

just as trying to net leaves you open to abuse by those happy to war that set

trying to abuse someone netting leaves you open to abuse by them at some point in the future when they are happy to war

maybe its not the best reason for war but its shouldnt be totally unexpected either

Yes. Clearly LaF is the abused one in this situation. Poor LaF. You guys wonder why everyone hates you? It's because you act like arrogant fluffs without an ounce of humility or decency and then try and excuse it away as you just doing what everyone else does. Which is not the case.

Just to expound, even when you admit you are wrong you still manage to be colossal fags. Your own head of FA admits you effed up and retalled on the wrong country. A normal human being taking this into account and seeing RD hit a maimed PDM would say hey, it's partially our bad. We'll cut you a little slack and just let you fight RD without continuing this further on our end. What do we get? This PoS making posts like this:

Lord Tarnava
Member
Posts: 315 Mar 1st 2011, 3:38:31
We did not call in RD to hit PDM, we were fine continuing to farm them. In fact they still owe us retals which we will continue to take.

Lord Tarnava
LaF war head type guy

no that was actually describing the RD/PDM situation

and just using abuse as a generic term for trying to use someone for something, be it land or fun

were happy to stop any time they want

no one in pdm has said they want us to stop, and some of them obviously still want to hit us

if they felt they could accomplish more flatout warring rd i think they may have wanted something different

ive mentioned this to pdm in private and on here, and also mentioned in private whether they want to get onboard in any larger conflicts that would perhaps alleviate some of the numerical and organisational issues they may be having

enshula: Why do you need PDM's agreement to do that? You should have just come out and stated that's what you were doing. Instead you guys seem all too eager to take advantage of the situation until PDM comes groveling to you for mercy.

to whoever said for me to use the quote function, if i'd quoted you i'd know who said it :P

"yes *I* am the one ruining the game Patty"
orkin

you can join rd, and do it far, far more effectively. we have a shared board with laf dedicated to this sole purpose!
(the shared board, of course, being the colours forum!)

You're not helping. :p

Why would we cease hitting pdm, when they have not ceased hitting us? We put pdm on dnh a long time ago, and they continued to folders us. How many times do we have to extend our hand and have it slapped away before we are deemed as being "in the right" for not continuing to extend it?

The only hand you've extended is a backhand. The "hand" you speak of is we just farmed the fluff out of you now lets DNH so we don't take retals.

Which is yet another arrogant modus operandi of LaF and one of the reasons you are generally reviled.

if you look at the alliance ranking on likability poll, LAF is fairly neutral while PDM is the least liked alliance in the game, Orkin.

If you look at the people who responded to that, it looked like about 2 PDM and all of LaF crawling out of the woodwork. =P

Also, being the least favorite of 14 or whatever doesn't mean you aren't the second to least favorite of 50.

Am I in PDM or making any of my arguements as an advocate of PDM? I started this off saying I think PDM folds up shop. But again of course you don't think people hate you. It's part of what helps your alliance continue to be so delusional about their practices and the perception of them. Then your members come out and make posts like "I don't understand why WE are always the bad guys! :((((((((("

Lets see, we tried to make peace, you ignored us... we retalled... you guys went overboard and we killed #36. You guys got pissed about that to later realize it was indeed your mistake and apologize for it... now that you have admitted you had no justification for farming us that would have been a good time to stop... instead when an alliance declared war on us you declared farming would continue... and you wonder why we haven't stopped hitting you?

Detmer you should take pointers from Balin and you would look less like idiots. Nice one sided comments there. That is all.

Everything I've said this set is essentially what Detmer just said but with more words. :)

Are you cereal? I liked Hanlong only lafers that arent fluff since my friends in laf left ages ago.

If I were to put my opinion quantitatively
Hanlong -1
Laf -2
PDM +1
Orkin-1
{bloop} -1

You nuked LaF and claimed legitimate retal.

End of story, that is an act of war, every alliance in the server except pdm considers mass missiles an act of war, killing #36 just happened to be the last straw as far as i can see.

17 hits in 24 hours is excessive, but either sort it out with an fr, or declare war, if you choose not to officially declare war but send mass missiles its the same as declaring war you just didnt post it on AT. Laf farming you for your retal policy is definately an appropriately proportional responce. In reality most alliance would have killed you for it much earlier.

We placed you on dnh with a "retal only" status way back on feb 19th. After which point your countries continued to top feed us multiple times per day (#449 comes to mind as a specific example). So we definitely tried...

I realize there are a lot of threads on the subject H4, but it was repeated often enough.

#449 was offered as a farm target to LaF before things got out of hand. You admitted that you goofed and put another country on farm, doing dozens of unjustified hits which eventually led to hanlong being killed, which you used as justification to farm us before RD FSed.

actually, looks like 449 only did one unprovoked hit on you, then you started grabbing him after you retaled. he was a n00b about it though and 'retaled' other LaFers when you grabbed him, which is why detmer told enshula to put him on farm. then you farmed him and he tripled tapped. could've probably been resolved easily if you weren't also simultaneously doing like 60+ grabs on another PDMer.

hanlong




Ummm.. why have you guys insisted you aren't at war with us then? Our retal policy clearly states missiles are cool so we had no reason to declare war. We aren't declaring war because you think our retal policy is an act of war... you declare war if you have a problem with it...


I tried to sort it out with FR but hanlong stopped responding to me. I have posted the logs multiple times. Once I did that he changed his story to I forget what. The point is you guys have moved on past that lie. We already have the material on hand to prove it is false so you need to come up with something else for us to disprove now...

My computer is on a moving truck somewhere and I have been browsing via iPhone for the last week and a half. As such I definitely have not been reading every post on every thread heh

What ever happened using reps to solve issues...

Perhaps its just me but I do find this post very amusing

"H4xOr WaNgEr
Member
Posts: 392
Quote Post
Mar 2nd 2011, 6:08:35
I find it amusing that Orkin is oh so sure that we got RD to bit for us, meanwhile the exact opposite is true. The truth is RD spent a lot of time convincing us not to hit pdm, to the point where we got pissed and threatened to fs pdm anyway because RD was taking too long. RD pushed their planned fs date more than once due to us threatening to ruin their war plans by fsing pdm first.

I still feel that we should have hit pdm regardless (RD needs to understand that when you plan a fs for that late in the round, you run the risk of someone beating you to the punch) but alas it wasnt up to me this time around. "

So H4 is here on a public board admitting that he had knowledge of RD fsing PDM and by the looks of things LaF tried/took advantage of this

I dont see any other way to interpret this, especially after H4s post

Because tyrs and dicts are more efficient (and fun).

troll troll troll troll troll



That was for de1i:p

You know you laughed.

Well said..And what we have been trying to get folks to see.

There is no other way to interpret it, because it is exactly what I implied. I do however disagree with the assertion that we were "taking advantage" of Pdm. Taking advantage of the situation? Sure, but would we have done it if we weren't on the verge of hitting them ourselves anyway? No. We were taking what we felt we were owed before our opportunity to do so was lost. That isn't taking advantage, it is common sense.

Other then the fact that,in 28 threads about this LaF has denied prior knowledge.

I would also like to note that just because certain laf people were aware of it, that doesn't mean all were (example: LT).

That's bs and you know it, If i have a policy of 1 hit = kill, you're not going to accept it. Just like LaF isnt going to accept a missile retal policy. Just because you write it as acceptable in your policy doesnt actually make it acceptable. I never said laf declared war on you, i said that their responce was proportionally appropriate.

I'm not going to get into he said she said with you because im not in laf, so i have no idea what was said to who. But there are 0 alliances on this server that will accept missile retals, its not just laf, and if you dont get that into your head, PDM will be killed/farmed every time they attempt to enforce their "retal policy". RD carried their beef over it from last set to this set, but had they not you would of been killed by rd last set and by Laf this... the fact you fail to recognise that doesnt bode well for pdm.

Wrong, 1 tag does accept missle retals..and has been stated BY RD, they were in the wrong on the retal escalations last set

Refer to my last post snawdog.

There were very few people that knew in advanced, from my understanding. At least one of whom (me) isn't a current leader or evenly overly active right now (although that is subject to change when the moving company finally shows up with my stuff)

RD accepts missile retals? I need to demote whatever FA told you that.

I'll agree to that H4, i was just pointing out that LaF leadership knew in advance.

1 tag does = PDM

the sad thing is.. i did laugh.

H4 knowing a allies plan for the set isn't exactly shocking.

PDM killed a LaF country. That pretty much is a declaration of war whether you post it on AT or not. At that point LaF was either going to farm PDM to crap or declare war. The mass farming is in response to killing the country.

If I am netting and know someone is gunning for them, common sense says farm the crap out of them.

This all comes down to one basic question.

Would LaF have farmed PDM 48 hours prior to RD FS if PDM had not killed a LaF country?

If the country wasn't killed. A few poeple with knowledge probably would have taken some cheap shots but not anything remotely close to level of what is happening now.

PDM should have just declared war on LaF. Even if you got creamed you could have just targeted those with largest stock in FS and put a dent in their netting. Or take what deal you can get that stops the hits for rest of set. You take a licking and plan fluff out and eventually you can kick their teeth in.

In the good old days I was farmed by LaF lots while in small alliances. As H4 probably remembers me harassing him on icq insistently. You work with what you can and hit them when it would hurt them most. (can we get an Wildcards/Exist reunion set and just FS LaF :-p)

Also trying to enforce retals with specialty attacks would be a hard enough thing for SoF to do let alone PDM. Why would you put your alliance in a position like that if you know you don't have activity to deal with fight it will assuredly lead to.

Gotcha, misread your post.

It is not BS. It makes perfect sense. If you don't like what we did it is your responsibility to declare war. Two people have different standards. Each one respects their own standards and not the other's. The appropriate thing is for each person to accept their own policy and declare war on the other person if the opposing policy makes them unhappy enough. In this case the burden is on LaF to declare war, not PDM. I know logic isn't your strong suit so if I need to explain that again I will.

It is not, it is just something that goes to show how premeditated this was on the part of LaF.



Ummmm no... people used to kill single countries back in the day when the offense was egregious enough. Countries used to die for 5 hits as standard policy. We were more lenient than that. I have zero doubt if someone hit you 7 times unprovoked, after earlier hostilities, that you would kill it too, without contact.



You see, you and your alliance mates are less ethical than most other people.



Yes.



Your FA said the hits he made, which resulted in his death, were due to spy ops. He apologized for farming an innocent country since he had to admit he was in the wrong. He also showed how easy it is to determine who did the spy ops. It is logical to assume he knew who made the spy ops at the time of the unjustified farming. Regardless, the farming itself was not justified and once LaF realized that, it would have made sense to stop hits since the whole thing was their fault. Since you guys could easily have known who did the spy ops, it only makes sense that what you did was intentional - after all we had already offered for you to farm and kill the country who actually did the spy ops.



Ummmm... why should everything devolve into war? We look for peaceful solutions. We are happy to have a small skirmish and move on. With the amount of regularity that LaF causes this exact infraction against us and their solution to then be DNH the rest of the set - there was no way we would bow down, again. We are also not snaky cowards like you and we do not go into hiding so we can sneak attack someone later.



No, you hit them when it is topical. We deal with a situation and once it is done we move on. If we die, we'll get revenge next chance we get. If we are alive we'll deal with it immediately. Again, I guess we just aren't two-faced cowards.



Umm, we stand up for what is right, not what is easy. LaF can fight us over this every round. RD won't be there to bail them out every time and then the fun netting games are over.