Fair 5:5 wars in which a third tag can farm one of the other tags? What constitutes war is special attacks + missiles + hostile spy ops I guess, otherwise you'd get deleted for grabbing a tag that was suicided, even if the suicide was with ops.

You need to clearly define what is a tag and what constitutes war and for how long a tag is considered at war after aggressions end for this to work.

I have never been deleted and intend to keep it that way by never stepping into grey areas. Thats very easy today, I have asked a mod for guidance once in the past year, thats it. Unless these rules are very clearly defined it won't be easy at all anymore on team server.

There is nothing in the current rules that stops 5vs5 wars from happening. The reason it doesnt happen more often is that one side is generally uninterested in warring altogether. Some tags solve this by going inactive when they get FSed, others call in allies. It's the fact that you generally dont find two evenly matched teams that want to war each others that is the problem. It's a problem of game size and lack of motivation to war.

All of your questions can be addressed by using EXPRESS model.

Question:
Fair 5:5 wars in which a third tag can farm one of the other tags?

If youre at war with a player on EXPRESS and you get LG one time by a 3rd party,. would that be considered 2v1? No.
What if that 3rd party attacked multiple times? Sure., it's possible..

Is there an exact # (or black and white answer) of the max attacks a 3rd party can do on EXPRESS? No.
Nor should TEAM. It's going to be situational. Marginal situations are likely going to favor the offender.

Question:
What constitutes war is special attacks + missiles + hostile spy ops I guess, otherwise you'd get deleted for grabbing a tag that was suicided, even if the suicide was with ops.

Answer:
What constitutes war on EXPRESS? If you got missiled and had hostile spy ops made to you then I think it's safe to say that player has engaged in war with you. Why would that be any different if a clan missiled / hostile spy op another TEAM?

The rules are not stopping 5v5., the alliances are. I think there are plenty of attacking teams on server. Over 50% of the TEAMs built last set were warring clans.

The teams don't have to be evenly matched., it just needs to remain capped at 5, where it was originally intended to be. It should be for players who are interested in small group play. I find my best 5 vs your best 5.

Against old rules coming back.

When ZigZag was netting and ZagZig wargaining six of the seven times either of them were FSed it was done to the netters in ZigZag(and once to both tags at the same time). Weedy used to sometimes just quit taking turns when they got hit and they got hit more times than ZagZig were during my combined sets in team server.

There is no way anyone thought our netters in ZigZag or any of our friends like weedy or Top10 for instance would declare war on someone in defence of ZagZig. So hitting ZagZig was a guaranteed recipie for a 1vs1 because they were always meant to kill/war and everyone knew it. That never happened.
So your theory of alliances stopping 1vs1 does not hold up to the slightest bit of scrutiny. No one that FSed any of the ZZs or weedy for that matter wanted a war. They wanted to ruin some netters set rather than have a real war.

This has always been one of the main problems with the server and why I think this morphing the server into alliance v2.0 is a neccesary evil as long as there are no formula/mechanic/bot changes that break the status quo. If this change was just putting lipstick on a pig I'd be for it, just change for the sake of change. But the most immediate effects this will have is it will run netters off the server as they will supercharge suiciders and remove perhaps the only counterplay a netting tag has to getting bullied by war tags reset after reset.

Anarchy anarchy anarchy anarchy

Sorry guys, I’m all hopped up on Mountain Dew

You guys are implementing way too much protections/restrictions/rules into this game.
If you want to block anyone from doing anything, please implement it from the game itself.
Stop relying/depending on the mods to do the deletion manually afterwards!
Not everyone will visit or bother to read every single post about game rules in the forum!
Your new restrictions and manual deletion will only make more players to stop playing.

currently team is alliance 2.0 (restriction of countries per team could be removed and give team its old name back and change current alliance to council as it was years ago) since wars are same aka multiple teams (alliances) against multiple teams (alliances) but market is f'ed up and no bots (players didn't want those so more wars and untaggeds and 1-2 country tags get farmed for land).

Like KoH said earlier we need Boltar back to police and kill anyone trying to sway a war.

FYI
Tella left the game, he quit playing, he quit modding, he was "not removed" because of his modding on this server.

This post was put up to get input from players. I have heard both sides on irc and forum pm's lately.

allbymyself: As I responded to you in a message about your deletion on express for sniping a kill (And every other mod you included after my answer because you felt I would get over ridden) that rule was implemented at the request of the players on express. I can guarantee you if you start a post about it over there and cry about how needs to be removed, you will get jumped on. If you don't have time to read rules and then cry about a rule, then maybe you should go back to Candyland.

I just think the game needs less rules and less mod interference.. not more

the game can police itself and the players can still enjoy it.. deleting players for jumping into wars is silly, if people want to war let them war

I had logs from QZ and elves that implied the team rules disaster lead to tella being removed from modding the server. I don’t know what was specifically said to tella about it. You can use your mod powers to see that tella was still playing alliance (and maybe FFA?) for a few sets after he stopped modding and before he left the game entirely. I was tracking his countries for a while as I considered rounding a group up to kill him in alliance for all of the damage he had done here.

Regardless, it was a bad idea then and it’s a bad idea now. Learn from history and don’t repeat the same mistakes. I can only hope you make the right decision! :-)

It will be a complete mod decision, meaning Warster, Prime and other mods will be involved. Which we decided to put this up first and get input. And no I cannot use "mod powers" to find if Tella was playing in alliance or FFA.
I feel bad for Tella if qzjul and nate said that because at the time that I was still a mod, that rule was implemented and it was discussed between the admin team and the mod team, it was not something Tella just decided to drop on you all.

The problem lies within all of the grey area introduced within the rules and the challenge with making consistent decisions.

The grey area is the problem, everyone wants the same thing and there are great suggestions as to how go about it, the consistent issue is that grey area, we have reached the point of "I'll be damned if I do, I'll be damned if I don't" .

If a team is unable to use FR, member activity, or game skills to protect themselves, then whatever happens to them should happen to them in the game. A mod shouldnt be around to bail out a team that is lazy.

If two teams (that are the same group) FS 1 team, then the team that got FSed should have relations with other teams to bail them out.

The game shouldnt rely or wait on mod actions for a game to work properly. What if the mod is not paying attention for a span of hours / days, then something happens, and even if deletion happens the other countries are messed up anyway. If the server was meant to be 1 team vs 1 team all the time, then it would have been built into the game.

How should warring be built into the game? Here are some ideas: https://www.earthempires.com/...alties-44496?t=1517071938

I completely agree. Keep mods out of Team. Also, keep bots out of Team. We're all doing just fine thanks.

No bots please!

May as well make TEAMs cap at 20., not 5. This server is basically Alliance with no bots.

Solution:
1. Put 25 bots on this server. [only dev action required]
2. If you didn't kill a suicider/rule breaker or participated in a mutual 1vs1 war this set or last you are not allowed to grab the bots, and the whole server will farm/maim/kill you if you do.
If you wall the mod will delete you.
If the mod sees you before the rest of the server, the mod will delete you.
3. All tags that did not exist last set are considered suiciders until each country is claimed by a known and reputable forum nick or until they kill a suicider not in their tag. If they don't they will not be deleted but are fair game to farm, FS, maim at will.
4. All tags that broke the server rules last set, did not participate in a mutual 1vs1 last set and did not score a kill on a suicider are considered new tags this set until they do. War tags are encouraged to FS these tags
5. All hits on tags that are not considered suiciders are against the rules. You will get killed or deleted unless the defending tag accepts your apology for hitting the wrong number. Defending tag may chose to retal without being considered rule breakers.
6. Mutual wars between any 2 willing parties will be policed by the entire server so they are indeed 1vs1 or whichever constallation was agreed. Any tag may also post on the board that they welcome an FS in case that is how they want to war. In such a case FSing this tag is not to be considered rule breaking.
7. Profit.

The only dev action needed will be to add the 25 bots. And if the mod goes offline for a set the server polices itself.

This creates something to do for killers, forces netters to take action against suiciders(and police the server with/for the killers) if they want to farm the bots, and at least improves the market. It also creates a way to make sure 1vs1 wars are kept 1vs1.

Excuse me?
I believe I did not say nor mention anything about Express in my comment.
Am I not allowed to comment in Team Server just because I have some disagreements with the mods in Express?

And look at your comment as a mod, you are now bashing on my comment saying I'm a cry baby.
Like really?
If you do not welcome or accept anyone against your new rules, then why bother to open for discussions?
Might as well implement it directly and claim that it is what everyone wants.

No where did I call you a cry baby sir. Stop twisting my words
P.S. We welcome all comments, but you seem to be against all rules. I may be reading it wrong. But it is how you are coming across

Adding bots in this server will destroy all X netting as it did in express, NO BOTS.

I'm not against all the rules.
I'm just against on the rules that need to be implemented or enforced manually by the mods such as the deletion.
If you don't allow players to do such things, then please block them in game rather than deleting them afterwards.
That's all I'm asking.

[quote poster=Gerdler; 46771; 892299]Solution:
1. Put 25 bots on this server. [only dev action required]
2. If you didn't kill a suicider/rule breaker or participated in a mutual 1vs1 war this set or last you are not allowed to grab the bots, and the whole server will farm/maim/kill you if you do.
If you wall the mod will delete you.
If the mod sees you before the rest of the server, the mod will delete you.
3. All tags that did not exist last set are considered suiciders until each country is claimed by a known and reputable forum nick or until they kill a suicider not in their tag. If they don't they will not be deleted but are fair game to farm, FS, maim at will.
4. All tags that broke the server rules last set, did not participate in a mutual 1vs1 last set and did not score a kill on a suicider are considered new tags this set until they do. War tags are encouraged to FS these tags
5. All hits on tags that are not considered suiciders are against the rules. You will get killed or deleted unless the defending tag accepts your apology for hitting the wrong number. Defending tag may chose to retal without being considered rule breakers.
6. Mutual wars between any 2 willing parties will be policed by the entire server so they are indeed 1vs1 or whichever constallation was agreed. Any tag may also post on the board that they welcome an FS in case that is how they want to war. In such a case FSing this tag is not to be considered rule breaking.
7. Profit.

The only dev action needed will be to add the 25 bots. And if the mod goes offline for a set the server polices itself.

This creates something to do for killers, forces netters to take action against suiciders(and police the server with/for the killers) if they want to farm the bots, and at least improves the market. It also creates a way to make sure 1vs1 wars are kept 1vs1. [/quote]

Well gerd wins.
Thread close.
Just kidding you all. But yeah have fun. Not going to bring it back. Thanks for the input!!! You all rock!

Learn to internet, n00b

I am not sure wtf happened N00b

Do I have to teach you now n00blet?

No Bots, PLEASE!!!

Galleri already said I won!

Boooo!!!!

Hmmmmmm. I missed this discussion and I'm glad. I agree with mob and gerdy mostly.

I only half agree with LI. I think they intended for teams and failed. Miserably.

To me, I've never been deleted completely off of a game for some rule I'm supposed to read on a forum page somewhere. That's unique to earth and it's flat out terrible. If you want people to not be able to do something in every other game ever, you make them unable to do it within the game.

I love you galleri, but you and i would learn to hate each other if you ever have to come to making judgement calls about whether or not i get deleted. And i like you more than i like this game so id probably just quit.

Alternatively we could just avoid that.

On another note, im 100% for having a version of SOTS programmed into the game and would, as always, throw $20 on making something code wise happen....


...although if my 20 only went toward sots on the team server id feel like my 20 went toward like the 152nd most important thing to address in the game.

Also, alliance is called alliance, not alliances.

Fortunately we all became friends because alliances worked together, and were not limited in foreign relations.

All that before we talk about how the fs is so overpowered that all wars will either be mutual or decided in the first 30 mins. Blindsided netting tags will have no choice but to quit.